To all Lawyers: US Travel Passport for non-citizens?

[adriano46]

Gentlemen,

 

An escort I have known for many years came to the US on a short-term Visa back in 2008 or so. Luckily, he was able to attain "asylum" status (coming from a country with a terrible gay-rights record), and currently has a valid Green Card, and was recently issued a U.S. Travel Passport.

 

Now while I do know some law, I am not a lawyer nor an immigration specialist. I have heard of travel passports in other countries for people who have lost theirs or who are refugees, but I never heard of this "US Travel Passport" although a google search did show me that it does exist, generally for people who are here with an asylum status and in possession of a Green Card.

 

This escort has been invited to accompany a client to the UK on a "business trip" for a few days. Since we are friends and I have given him advice in the past, he called me urgently yesterday asking about the regulations for a Visa for the U.K. I do know that those who possess a valid U.S. Passport can enter the U.K. without a Visa.

 

But what of a person who only has the U.S. Travel Passport?" Is this considered in the same way as a US Passport? Does anyone have any idea?

 

Thanks -- answer here or PM me.

[+ Funguy]

To be on the safe side he should go to the British Consulate in his city. Thus, information will be up to date and not hearsay.

[adriano46]

Funguy, that is what I told him; unfortunately the nearest consulate is either in NYC or DC and he lives in FL, but he does see clients quite a bit in NYC. However, if it is like most consulates, you have to make a reservation even to talk to a consular officer (I know this from my own experience getting long-term work visas for other places -- and standing on lines in NYC for hours). Thanks though for the advice that pretty much was mine to him (personally I felt the client who invited him on the trip should have done this homework...)

[sincitymix]

he might not need to talk to the consular officer, he could call the consulate, they probably have people answering the phones who can answer simple questions.

[+ Funguy]

You might tell him to call one of the big, international travel agencies such as Protravel - I believe they have offices in Florida.

[Guest]

There is no such thing as a "travel passport." Unless he's a US citizen, what he has is a refugee travel document:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugee_travel_document

http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/pub/images/bsf5023/rtdppt.jpg

 

Although countries such as the UK which have signed the convention on refugees treaty or whatever it's called are supposed to treat the refugee travel document as if it were a passport from the issuing country, most (including, I believe, the UK) do not. I know this since my ex went through the same process when he came from the Russian Federation. Some countries which DO treat it as if it were a US Passport include Germany, Canada, Mexico, and some Caribbean countries. While it is possible to enter other Schengen countries by coming in via Germany and then traveling to other Schengen countries, the UK and the Irish Republic are NOT in the Schengen area, so you cannot use this system. Traveling on refugee travel documents is very difficult, because they take several months (like, seven or so) to process, they're only valid for 1 year, and they cost $400 a pop. In addition, most countries won't let you in unless you have 6 months of validity beyond the entry date.

[Rudynate]

There was some talk of suspending the Schengen Agreement to stem illegal immigration. That didn't happen?

[+ peterhung85]

Just have him call any of the British Consulates in the USA. That is as official answer as he can possibly get.

[marylander1940]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statelessness

 

In law, statelessness is the lack of any nationality or a (legal passport), or the absence of a recognized link between an individual and any state. A de jure stateless person is someone who is "not considered as a national by any state under the operation of its law".[1] A de facto stateless person is someone who is outside the country of his or her nationality and is unable or, for valid reasons, unwilling to avail himself or herself of the protection of that country.[2] De facto statelessness can be a result of persecution or a consequence of lack of diplomatic relations between the state of nationality and the state of residence.

 

http://demo.blissbrandagency.com/magnoli/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/extra-image-1121.jpg

[Guest]

To be on the safe side he should go to the British Consulate in his city. Thus, information will be up to date and not hearsay.

 

Just have him call any of the British Consulates in the USA. That is as official answer as he can possibly get.

 

He should only go to the consulate if he lives next to one, and has too much time on his hands. A phone call might work, but most consulates make it very difficult to talk to someone. The website of the British Embassy in the US should give you the information much more easily. Actually, looking at their website, it looks as if holder of US Refugee Travel Documents do NOT need a visa.

 

https://www.gov.uk/check-uk-visa/y/usa/tourism

[Guest]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statelessness

 

In law, statelessness is the lack of any nationality or a (legal passport), or the absence of a recognized link between an individual and any state. A de jure stateless person is someone who is "not considered as a national by any state under the operation of its law".[1] A de facto stateless person is someone who is outside the country of his or her nationality and is unable or, for valid reasons, unwilling to avail himself or herself of the protection of that country.[2] De facto statelessness can be a result of persecution or a consequence of lack of diplomatic relations between the state of nationality and the state of residence.

 

 

A refugee or asylee is NOT a stateless person. If my ex were ever to return to his country, he would definitely be considered Russian. Now that he's an American, he probably could get a Russian passport if he really wanted one (but he doesn't). In fact, the refugee travel document indicates the country of citizenship of the holder of the document. Countries which have signed the convention on the status of refugees may NOT, however, ever deport a refugee or asylee to his country. They must send the person to the country which gave the holder asylum.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convention_relating_to_the_Status_of_Refugees

[marylander1940]

A refugee or asylee is NOT a stateless person. If my ex were ever to return to his country, he would definitely be considered Russian. Now that he's an American, he probably could get a Russian passport if he really wanted one (but he doesn't). In fact, the refugee travel document indicates the country of citizenship of the holder of the document. Countries which have signed the convention on the status of refugees may NOT, however, ever deport a refugee or asylee to his country. They must send the person to the country which gave the holder asylum.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convention_relating_to_the_Status_of_Refugees

 

I know... but without a passport he's pretty much stateless/"passportless" which is the point of this thread, isn't it?

 

I'm just trying to help, maybe he can get help and get a passport from his country, the UN or anywhere else.

 

"A de facto stateless person is someone who is outside the country of his or her nationality and is unable or, for valid reasons, unwilling to avail himself or herself of the protection of that country"

[adriano46]

Thanks guy for all the help. Yes, he has the Refugee Travel document you mentioned, Unicorn, and yes he is from the Russian Federation, and I am assuming that the UK continues to be a bit skeptical having more Russians in their back yard.

 

I have to admit that both the US Immigration Service web page and the UK page on Visas were so complicated I gave up trying to navigate them (and I am a native English speaker!). I think they purposely wrote them this way so you never find a phone number to call.

[+ Gar1eth]

Here is the website regarding UK Visas. There is an option to pick for refugees/stateless persons. It says they require a Visa to visit the UK.

 

https://www.gov.uk/check-uk-visa

 

I'm going to assume that he's already checked that his U.S. Refugee Travel Document allows him to travel outside the U.S. and then allows him back in.

 

Gman

[Guest]

I'm just trying to help, maybe he can get help and get a passport from his country, the UN or anywhere else.

 

Aack! No, no, no, no! Under no circumstances should he ask for a passport from his country of nationality!! This will invalidate his refugee/asylee status! It could make him subject to immediate deportation and very much complicate his application for U.S. citizenship. Any immigration documents he receives (including an application for citizenship or a refugee travel document) will ask if he has applied for any assistance from his country, including specifically a passport (or, of course, any social-security type benefits, etc.). Any "yes" answer to such a question will cause BIG trouble! To get back in the US, he will need to have a refugee travel document (NOT an UN Laissez Passer, which has limited utility), and if there are any stamps on that document written in the cyrillic alphabet, expect being taken in for questioning. Needless to say, any Russian stamp will lead to being denied admission, of course.

[Irtwo]

How come Unicorn and Gman got completely opposite answers from that UK site (as to whether a visa is required)?

[thickornotatall]

Funguy, that is what I told him; unfortunately the nearest consulate is either in NYC or DC and he lives in FL, but he does see clients quite a bit in NYC. However, if it is like most consulates, you have to make a reservation even to talk to a consular officer (I know this from my own experience getting long-term work visas for other places -- and standing on lines in NYC for hours). Thanks though for the advice that pretty much was mine to him (personally I felt the client who invited him on the trip should have done this homework...)

https://www.gov.uk/government/world/organisations/british-consulate-general-miami

[thickornotatall]

Funguy, that is what I told him; unfortunately the nearest consulate is either in NYC or DC and he lives in FL, but he does see clients quite a bit in NYC. However, if it is like most consulates, you have to make a reservation even to talk to a consular officer (I know this from my own experience getting long-term work visas for other places -- and standing on lines in NYC for hours). Thanks though for the advice that pretty much was mine to him (personally I felt the client who invited him on the trip should have done this homework...)

https://www.gov.uk/government/world/organisations/british-consulate-general-miami

[sincitymix]

https://www.gov.uk/check-uk-visa/y

[+ Gar1eth]

How come Unicorn and Gman got completely opposite answers from that UK site (as to whether a visa is required)?

 

It probably depends on whether the Refugee USA Travel Document is considered the same as a USA Passport. If it is-no visa would be required. But looking at Refugee status on the website, you do need a visa.

 

So I guess the only way to know for sure would be to contact the proper UK Office.

 

Gman

[Guest]

How come Unicorn and Gman got completely opposite answers from that UK site (as to whether a visa is required)?

We don't disagree. We used the same website. You just have to follow the links. If you can reach them, it wouldn't hurt to call the consulate or embassy to be sure. I would copy the page which I referenced, so that you can show the airline people checking you in, in case they're confused. Many airline employees have never seen a refugee travel document (we had to get a supervisor once). When you get to the airport, the document can be scanned just like a US passport. We would carry along the page from the German consulate which showed that no visa is necessary, in order to be on the safe side, but never had to use it (we went to Germany 3 times before he became a US citizen).

[adriano46]

Again, guys, thanks for all this information. I passed it on to the escort in question and it is up to him (and the client who wants to bring him to UK for a few days) to make the next move. As always, it has been great seeing how quickly you here can respond to information requests based on your own experiences and backgrounds.