The term ‘plain vanilla’ re: client/escort expectations?

[eeyore]

I would like some clarification about the term ‘plain vanilla’ as it is sometimes used by clients to tell an escort what they are looking for during a session. I have seen the term used in some reviews and posts, and I have used the phrase myself in a few reviews and/or posts here, but now I want to make sure I’m using it correctly and not too loosely. Here’s what I think it means: a ‘plain vanilla’ client is into lots of intimate body contact, rubbing, hugging, petting, worship and foreplay, followed by a good quality J/O session. I personally enjoy deep passionate sensual kissing and I’m hoping that it may include this as well, but it seems from my readings that the kissing issue usually needs to be made explicit in advance (or else you hope it just happens). I’m not clear if it assumes oral (either giving or receiving) and I’m assuming it does NOT include any anal. The proprietor of a Montreal agency once asked me what I was into and in addition to discussing the body type, age and looks of the boy I wanted I threw in the statement that I was a pretty ‘plain vanilla J/O’ kind of guy. After returning my initial call to confirm the appointment, he asked me what I meant by ‘plain vanilla jerk off’ – neither he nor his boy had heard of the term (lol…). I’m assuming that it was the language/cultural barrier (French Quebecois), but then I got to thinking that maybe this term is too general and vague and may mean different things to different folks (or cultures). I’m exposing my general sexual incompetence level here so, please, I ‘m interested in CONSTRUCTIVE responses from both escorts and clients on the definition of this phrase and its mutual expectations.

[Boston Guy]

I think you might be reading too much into this term. To me, it simply means 'fucking and sucking', excluding any unusual variations on those activities, and definitely excluding anything normally considered more esoteric or adventurous. I wouldn't take "plain vanilla" to mean anything at all about cuddling, kissing, etc.

 

It will be interesting to see how other people use the term.

 

BG

[DelawareGuy]

I agree with Boston Guy. "Vanilla" to me means your run of the mill garden variety sex. Some people use the phrase "mild to wild"; vanilla is definitely the mild part.

[JakeSamers]

Yeah, Vanilla means regular sex, no weird stuff.

 

Jake Samers

Houston

 

http://home.earthlink.net/~jakesamers-m4m

[+ Charlie]

To me, plain vanilla normally connotes just sucking, fucking, and jacking off, no fetishes or role-play. Kissing is vanilla to me, but chocolate to some.

[whipped guy]

eeyore! As others have indicated vanilla plain or otherwise simply means no kink… I jokingly use the trerm “fat-free vanilla” to illustrate more or less what you describe above. In fact I have even requested sessions that involve a mixture of kink and "fat-free vanilla"… though I give a more overt and unambiguous description of what I would expect.

 

I thought of the phrase one night after leaving a particularly invigorating BDSM session when I stopped for a fat-free vanilla frozen yogurt at a concession stand in Penn Station in NYC… as it seemed like the perfect antidote to what I had just experienced!

 

Perhaps we should contact the folks at Wikipedia and coin a new phrase so to speak!

[+ deej]

I, too, think you're putting too much into it. In fact, there is no single definition and there's the issue of context.

 

Plain vanilla is generally considered the opposite of kinky, but everyone's version of what's kinky is different. To some in our society, two men (or two women) kissing is kinky. To some men, rimming is kinky.

 

Now, it's a safe bet most wouldn't associate leather, BDSM, or fisting, or singing along with the Ethel Merman Disco Album ;-) with vanilla. But as soon as I say that, someone will say "I do that all the time! What's kinky about it?"

 

If you're talking to an escort about what you like, and in your mind "Plain Vanilla" covers your entire grocery list, you'd better read off the grocery list. The term may mean something different to him.

 

In a review, the phrase is fine when used to mean "not into kink" because nobody reading the review will care about your shopping list. Hopefully your review will cover the activities of the day.

[Juan Vancouver]

Hey Eeyore,

 

Considering the fact that enlish is my second language and I have been only speaking it the last 5 years of my life (or so), I really like any talk about language and its uses.

 

Throughout my escorting career I have been put into situations in which the use of language (or misuse of it) can be really uncomfortable. Or sometimes simply surprising. As many have said the term Vanilla means as many different things as many people use it. The generally accepted idea is that it means mild, low risk, low creativity sex. But in my experience whenever you use a vague idea like that to request a service you are putting yourself in a disadvantage. You might not get what you were expecting for.

 

I have met gentlemen who announced that they were pretty vanilla, and in the middle of the session they asked me to spank them, fist them, tie them up, do pretty heavy duty stuff. When after the session I amusedly mentioned the "vanilla" expectation that I had of them, several times I have received similar answers:

 

"Oh, of course, I am pretty vanilla... You, know no blood, no scat, no leather... I hate that stuff."

 

In some other ocasions when greeting a "vanilla" client I have approached to hug and kiss, just to have them jump ten feet away in a dazed stupor, blushing and mumbling:

 

"I don't kiss... I clearly requested vanilla!"

 

After one year of hit and miss I decided that whenever someone used a pretty euphemism to describe his expectations I would ask for clear, concrete details. Every single time, I am amazed by the dissimile responses that I get.

 

If I go to a decorator I don't ask him to give me a "pretty" house. That can be vague and risky. I would ask for a "Contemporary loft-style, stainless-steel, black granite, wood and suede in earthy tones with lots of tropical looking plants". That way I am sure that I am going to get something that will be fulfilling to me.

 

My only recommendation (a single concept that I have been repeating since the first time I posted in this message centre) is:

 

"Be kind, be clear, be open, and kindly make sure that you were understood."

 

Happy hiring!

[+ deej]

Thank you, Juan.

 

You have exactly described a concept that comes from the study of architecture (and is popular right now with software engineers). It's called design patterns.

 

If you tell an architect you want a door in a wall, he gets the general idea. You want some form of conveyance to the other side of the wall. He doesn't know whether you want French doors, a pocket door, a solid Mahogany door with a big brass knocker, or the Great Gate of Kiev. But he knows the general concept.

 

"Vanilla" is a design pattern. It describes someone's comfort level in their own terms. It describes nothing concrete. Comfort levels vary.

 

(And you properly bring up the problem of English as a second language. Thank you!)

 

It pays to be specific.

[curious2000]

I agree with Juan in that you have to be very clear and specific in what you expect from an encounter. I always thought that "vanilla" was just the basic sucking,fucking,with hugging and kissing and jo thrown in. But other's think vanilla does not include kissing, while other's think rimming is kinky. Everyone seems to agree vanilla mean nothing too extreme or kinky or "non-vanilla" which I'm sure is open to different definitions as well, LOL.Also, some have said "pretty vanilla,plain vanilla, and just vanilla" which could be confused with three slightly different kinds of degrees of vanilla. LOL

 

I think the best thing is not use that term, and just communicate exactly what you want. I always do. I always make sure an escort will french kiss, enjoys mutual oral where we both suck each other, and that I love to rim him and don't expect him to rim me,and that I love lots of licking and forplay, and that I'm versatile about anal depending upon my mood. Now that might not fit neatly into "vanilla" or "plain vanilla" to others, but to me it does fit into just vanilla. Or since I like rimming, and sometimes licking pits, then maybe I am a chocolate and vanilla swirl? LOL. Just a little wilder than plain ole vanilla.

:9

[whipped guy]

Juan!

 

As usual you have said it all... and have done so in an articulate, lucid, and logical fashion.

 

I always look forward to your reasoned and well-written postings…I would have never thought that English was not your first language…

[JT Brooklyn]

Yes Guys, Juan does make a Hell of a "Vanilla Shake"! LOL :7

[Steven_Draker]

If you look at the classification made by Rentboy

 

Check all that apply:

 

Vanilla (None)

Leather

Fisting

Water Sports

Anal

S&M

B&D

Scat

Oral

Shaving

Spanking

Diapers

Latex

Role Playing

PNP

Kissing

 

one would assume that 'Vanilla' excludes all of the above.

 

 

Steven Draker ~

 

cell 202-674-9868

email StevenDraker@yahoo.com

website http://www.hotsexystud.com/uk

reviews http://www.male4malescorts.com/reviews/steven_draker_brussels.html

[Funseeker 22]

>If you look at the classification made by

>Rentboy

>

>Check all that apply:

>

>Vanilla (None)

>Leather

>Fisting

>Water Sports

>Anal

>S&M

>B&D

>Scat

>Oral

>Shaving

>Spanking

>Diapers

>Latex

>Role Playing

>PNP

>Kissing

>

>one would assume that 'Vanilla' excludes

>all of the above.

>

Guess that just leaves me then with gun oil and my hand.

 

;-) ;-)

[JT Brooklyn]

Kissing,Oral,Anal some Role Play is considered "Vanilla"..Usually Included in the Working Guy's Rate!

 

BUT just about everyone will "Probably" ask about these things, prior to the Hookup Anyway...

 

BUT "Definitely" All of the remaining things will be discussed!

And The Rate can change, for Specialists, into Special Things.

I have met a few Specialists in NYC... :7

[eeyore]

Thanks to everyone for all the feedback on this. After reading all the replies I think I'm ready for a chocolate shake!

[Juan Vancouver]

Would you like to super-zise your order, sir? :9 }(

[Guest Dan]

I've had clients who after they shot, were just fine with me leaving, whether I'd come or not. As far as they were concerned, business had concluded!

 

Dan Dare

http://www.geocities.com/dandare_laca/DanDare4Hire.html