CHANGING CAREERS

[Guest CrackTheGraySky]

In the past many of you have been of help to me. Now I have another important question for you.

 

I currently work in the consumer finance industry. The limitations on my salary at this point in my life is depressing me. At the age of 51 I've been doing this for 19 years and am still at the mid management level.

 

What I want to do is switch careers. Over the past 6 months I've searched for something that had little to no start up cost, would not cap my potential income and allow me some flexibility in my hours, so I decided to be an escort (sorry, that was my attempt at humor). So I decided on being an independent insurance agent. Focusing on autombile, life and home insurance.

 

The problems I'm having are: is it too much of a pipe dream to want to do this and to make it successfull? Am I risking a boring 'career' that barely pays the bills but at least pays them for a silly notion? Did I select a realistic new career in insurance sales?

 

Does anybody have like experience? If so where do I begin? It all seems kind of risky to me, what do you guys feel?

[Guest 2004]

Hey - I don't know about insurance sales but if it feels right go for it. Don't dwell on it.

[Guest 2004]

Hey - I don't know about insurance sales but if it feels right go for it. Don't dwell on it.

[HooBoy]

Well, while I am waiting for hours for today's site to come up with this new software, when it only took minutes before, I will respond to this while I watch Mr. Bean on my DVD.

 

First, my heart goes out to you. But that is why baseball is so popular because most people are miserable in their jobs.

 

As I has said before, I never have worked for a living and I consider myself the luckiest guy on the planet.

 

If you can find something you LOVE to do, just say "what the fuck" and do it. I have always found that when you do what you love, the money will follow.

 

When people set money as their goal, they ultimately fail, with some exceptions.

 

Then, there are people who I know on this board who had great careers, loved their jobs, got screwed over by management types and at the age of 50ish find themselves out of a career, out of the job they loved and scraping by.

 

I am far from being wealthy, but I am happy -- most of the time and you can tell when I am not because I wear my heart on my sleeve.

 

But I just don't give a damn - and I am the luckiest guy on the planet. I hope this gave you an answer to your question. Try something new and exciting and interesting and when all else fails, the real money is in Sales. And if you can be honest, love your product, have a good relationship with people, you'll have a good time and make money too.

 

It is only when the guy above you is so insecure that he screws up your life. And may they rot in hell.

 

And someday, I will learn how to use this software and turn the whole project over to HooBaby.

 

Good luck!

 

__

 

The above written as a regular guy, not the owner of a website and has no official meaning, just unofficial BS.)

__

 

--garbo the hoo

[OneFinger]

Hey Crack,

 

Not sure I can help but I do have some opinions and experiences from my life. We're about the same age and, although I'm not management, my position and compensation is comparable to a middle-level manager.

 

It used to really bother me to have some boss that was young enough to be my son and didn't know enough to do my job. I also used to be frustrated about my earning potential (or lack of it). However, I since changed that by having an attitude and lifestyle adjustment. Here's what I did:

 

1. Evaluated My Priorities: Did I really want to be on the management treadmill with all the requisite headaches and required ass-kissing? I decided my job was not really that bad - especially since I knew all the shortcuts. Plus, I could be a top performer with minimal effort. I decided it was only a job and did not let it define my self-worth or dictate my off-the-clock time.

 

2. Get Out of Debt: My need for more money was really dictated by my debt. I'm now debt-free (except for my home). I'm now able to make double payments on the house, fully fund both my 401K and a Roth IRA, and put 20% of my take-home pay into savings. One of my goals is to be able to work at a minimum wage job (if necessary)without changing my lifestyle. That way, I'm not afraid of being canned or laid off. Eventually, I want to be able to work less hours and spend more time playing (and hiring).

 

3. Become Involved in Other Activities: I've been involved in community groups, musical organizations, joined a sports league, and sometimes supplement my income with consulting work.

 

In your particular instance, it may be time for a career change. But, make sure you're not jumping from the fry pan into the fire. I'm not a salesman so the idea of selling insurance doesn't appeal to me. I believe it takes considerable time to develop a good client base. It could be very lean times while you're getting started. But, if money is not an issue and you're a good people person, I think insurance could be a great job.

 

I'd recommend that you carefully evaluate your options and motives. Sometimes your current situation really isn't that bad. Good luck and keep us posted.

[Guest 10cc]

To switch careers is very hard. Onefinger and HB offer different advice but they are both on the money.

 

It depends on what you feel is best for you. If more income is important and you are maxed at your present job then it might be a good move. Especially if the cost of living in your town is high.

 

You might want to remain in your career and move to a less expensive city. That might be extreme if you have friends and other ties to where you now live.

 

Best to check with people who might hav made a change later in life like you are considering. They probably can offer more insight.

 

Maybe others here like onefinger and HB have other expeiences they can share. Either way I wish you the best.

[Guest CrackTheGraySky]

Thank you men for your interesting view of my situation. I am still seeking answers and ideas but I feel that I need to make a change.

 

Hooboy suggests best to do something one loves but I do not hae this option. Financially I can not hope it would brin in enough money to live on. So the next best thing in my mind is to try something new, but it scares me.

 

Onefinger also had a good idea. But where I live it is very expensive and getting out of debt, let alone savin money, is near impossible without drastically changing my lifestyle. I live modest as it is and making additional changes would probably create depression and I have already been fighting this.

 

Still no resolution but I have taken all of your feedback, yes thank you 10cc too, and from a few friends I have and still considering what would be best to do.

 

I see two chocies now, I can stay at my job and just be happy if I can be happy, like onefinger does or I can try something risky but it might lead to a better income which might improve my lifestyle.

 

Hard decision indeed.

[Guest YFSC]

>The problems I'm having are: is it too much of a pipe dream to

>want to do this and to make it successfull? Am I risking a

>boring 'career' that barely pays the bills but at least pays

>them for a silly notion? Did I select a realistic new career

>in insurance sales?

>

>Does anybody have like experience? If so where do I begin? It

>all seems kind of risky to me, what do you guys feel?

 

I don't know anything about selling insurance, and you didn't say just what kind of a job you are doing in consumer finance. Switching careers at 51 is not easy, as I'm sure you are aware, but it can be done and has been done.

 

Not everyone would make a good salesman. I'm sure you know that and must have considered that angle before settling on that as a new career. But, realistically, at 51 many of the possible career options are not very available to you any more, and if you settled on that one in desperation simply as the least objectionable of limited unappealing alternatives, or of the possibilities that fit your criteria stated above (which didn't include anything about job satisfaction or enjoyment), that may not be a wise choice. I don't mean to sound negative, but you should consider that aspect as well, if you haven't already. That's not to say that you should reject the change just on that basis, but you should think about it from that point of view and see if that makes a difference to you.

 

On the other hand, what I said above may not be relevant, and you may fit the salesman mold very well and that may be something that you would enjoy doing.

 

Some guys here may be able to give you experiences/advice in changing careers. But you should also talk to people who are selling insurance if you haven't already done so. It's probably best not to do that right nearby. You didn't say anything about where you live. If you are in a big city, it's easy enough to find an insurance agent in another part of town and ask if you can talk to him/her. If you are in a small town you might want to drive out 20 miles or so to a nearby town to talk to someone.

 

Whatever you do, and however it works out, best of luck. Let us know how it's going.

[Guest DevonSFescort]

>But where I live it is very

>expensive and getting out of debt, let alone savin money, is

>near impossible without drastically changing my lifestyle...

 

>I see two chocies now, I can stay at my job and just be happy

>if I can be happy, like onefinger does or I can try something

>risky but it might lead to a better income which might improve

>my lifestyle.

 

It sounds like the option of relocation either hasn't occurred to you or has already been taken off the table. In case the former is true, I'd like to point out that making a change of scenery part of your career changing strategy could strengthen your position in one or more of the following ways:

 

1) Though it may seem counterintuitive (and if it's contrary to your personal experience then please disregard this), sometimes it can be easier, and more invigorating, to change virtually everything about your life rather than just one really hard thing.

 

2) Geographical moves can disrupt stagnation and inject a sense of adventure into a process that would otherwise be more scary (or tedious) than exciting. A shift in location often triggers a shift in perspective, which can enable you to see possibilities you previously couldn't. There are perfectly good art schools in Minneapolis, where I once lived and endured the longest unrelenting period of malaise of my adult life. In fact, I knew and hung out with a bunch of art students, but it never occurred to me, or to them, that I, too, might be an artist or at least someone who could get accepted into, and benefit from, art school, until I got to Boston. Almost as soon as I unloaded the cargo van one of my first decisions, which came seemingly out of nowhere, was to start taking Super-8 and photography classes through a continuing education program. A year later I was deciding which scholarship to accept as a full time student. The Boston, and later, San Francisco, versions of me have done things and had experiences that Minneapolis me wouldn't even have daydreamed about, though many, if not most of them, could just as, or nearly, as easily have happened there, but for my sense of impossibility that only moving could dislodge.

 

3) If you pick an area to live that's cheaper, is attracting job growth, and will afford you a better standard of living for less money, that relocation will support your debt reduction strategy (and having once been in debt I can absolutely vouch for how good it feels to get out of it). Additionally, it will ease some of the financial strain if your new career doesn't take off right away, or, alternatively, allow the money you make in a similar position at a new company to go farther. (You can also start out by staying in the same career but transitioning out once you've gotten your bearings. I've done that.) In a way I'm poorly positioned to be making this point because I tend to have expensive tastes when it comes to cities, but that may be changing. If I were ever to leave San Francisco, which feels like home after six and a half years, it would probably be to go somewhere where I can afford studio space, instead of having to make do with the tiny "dining room" in my studio apartment. I think a lot of people accept financially crippling, emotionally stifling situations in order to live in a fabulous area, which they end up not having the time, energy or disposable income to really enjoy.

 

4) If you have negative people in your life it will get you away from them. Yes, to an extent the same can be said for the people who are good for you, but if they're really good for you you won't lose them, even if you're not in the same city anymore.

 

Of course, moving itself is not exactly cheap, but it can be more manageable to raise the money for a move than to start a new business in a area where it costs a lot to live. And if you have property where you live now and sell it to relocate to a cheaper area, you can come out ahead in that regard as well.

 

Good luck whatever you decide to do. I have no idea whether much or any of what I wrote is applicable to you, but hopefully someone will find parts of it helpful.

[HooBoy]

I wish I could make ONE post without an edit dammit.

 

Dear One Finger,

 

It is a horrible decision and so many of my friends your age are going through the same dilemma.

 

If you do not mind me asking and you feel like sharing, you mentioned there is something you really love or like but took the negative path of it will never work for me. Do not feel obligated about pouring out your misgivings here.

 

Second, I think the best work in the world (other than being a greeter at WalMart) is in sales with commission on a product you believe in. Good salesmen do not SEll. They LISTEN to their prospective customer and soon become trusted partners in effect with their clients. I call them "assistant buyers". And if you like Golf, you've got it made. I don't, but that's another drama revelation to come.

 

But good companies are always looking for good "assistant buyers."

 

Don't try and sell pots to a guy like me who doesn't know how to cook or even ever used a stove or oven. Sales can be the most rewarding adventure in your life, if you have the right product and not some dumb shit over you like in that great movie "Glengarry Glen Ross" (1992)

 

Because I am a computer dummy and turning over day to day stuff to someone else at the suggestion of Keith, the owner of http://www.cruisingforsex.com, I am having a blast becoming more involved in this MESSAGE CENTER.

 

Now that we got rid of the hatemongers, this place is beginning to rock. Well, if you answer my questions here or in your head, [b}you can do it....just be positive.[\b]

 

I love the line from some Brad Pitt movie, "are you a Mexican or mexican't?"

 

Personally, I am FilipineYES, not Filipino.

 

 

The above written as a regular guy, not the owner of a website and has no official meaning, just unofficial BS.)

__

 

--garbo the hoo

[OneFinger]

>Dear One Finger...If you do not mind me asking and you feel like sharing, you mentioned there is something you really love or like but took the negative path of it will never work for me. Do not feel obligated about pouring out your misgivings here.

 

HooBoy, I think your comment was meant for CrackTheGraySky. I've been lucky enough to find a niche or specialty that I really do love but will never make a million dollars. I use a specialized and expensive software program and people with my skills are in big demand with a larger companies. But, someone in my position is not on the fast-track to top management positions. I do make a comfortable salary and doubt I'll ever be out-of-work. But, I'll also never be the top dog.

 

I've come to the conclusion that working in a support/staff position is less stressful to me than management.

[OneFinger]

>...Onefinger also had a good idea. But where I live it is very expensive and getting out of debt, let alone saving money, is near impossible without drastically changing my lifestyle. I live modest as it is and making additional changes would probably create depression and I have already been fighting this.

 

We seem to have a lot in common. I've had some serious problems with depression and know how that can intensify with job issues or financial changes. x(

 

Have you considered how a major job change might affect your depression? For me, I like the "safety net" of being an employee with health care benefits, 401K, etc. I would not do well in a self-employed position such as insurance agent where my salary (and the cost of benefits) was directly linked to sales or commissions. The thought of something like that scares me to death.

 

But, is there some reason you can't keep your current job and start working insurance on the side? That might give you a little bit of cushion to build up your clientèle and know if that job is something you want to do full-time. It really seems like an ideal second job that could grow into a new career.

[VaHawk]

Okay, but try having your entire career being outsourced overseas and listen to the bullshit about how you are supposed to grin and bear it and start all over at ground zero at the bottom of the ladder in a new pursuit, where the gz's are all at the bottom of the pay scale and 30 years younger. Talk about bs, suicidal depression, then BRING IT ON!

[Guest Utopia]

You have received a lot of good advice so far though the opinons vary. I am a believer that sales is the best way to go if you're concerned about salary being max'd out. Most sales positons limit your income only by your own limitations.

 

But I kind of like what One Finger said about the security of your current job. Maybe if you go on your own you will do very well .. and maybe not. If not do you have a back up plan?

 

Personally I am looking to move to a better enviorment where the cost of living isn't as high as my hometown in So. California. If I can find a positoon somewhat like my current one and reduce my daily expenses (looking in the northwest) that would be great .. I am about your age and you might want to consider that instead. I think Devon suggested that too.

 

Also HooBoy asked you a interesting question what do you want to do that makes you happy but you said you cannot do it? I am just wondering what it is, professional sky diver ?

===

"You realize that life goes fast

It's hard to make the good things last"

[Guest]

I know I'm chiming in a little late, but here's my 2 cents. I personally think that 51 is a late and risky age to begin a new career unless you have enough money to retire on comfortably at this time, or if you're really comfortable you'll be successful in you new job (i.e. you know you're a great salesman). You don't want to lose your nest egg if you fail, i.e. be that 70 year old greeter at WalMart who needs the extra income to make ends meet.

[Guest CrackTheGraySky]

So many nice replies I have read each one and have taken your words to heart. I will also try to answer a few of your questions.

 

Devon, Moving is an option that I think about now and then. I agre it can be fun and a postive situation. Though the places where I would like to live Portland or Seattle don't have many positions in my current field. And to move to begin a new career I feel will be too much. I have considered Las Vegas as a possible alternative and actually sent a few resumes out in that city.

 

Unicorn, I know that I am taking a huge risk if I do take the jump to sales. But the way I am feeling (trapped) I might have to take that chance. I know my age is a concern and appreciate your words.

 

Onefinger, you continue to add some really interesting advice. I hope one day we can meet for a drink.

 

Hooboy, I have no problem answering your question. But first I have to clarify what I wrote. I gave the impression there was something that I would love to do - that wasn't exactly what I meant. What I should have said there is something I know I can do and do very well but financially I know it will never happen.

 

I also need to put in a disclaimer here as some will probably dislike me due to my occupation but I understand that it is considered very negative to many of you.

 

I'm in consumer colletions management. What I was referring to was going into business for myself. I know the business inside and out, I know how profitable it can be, start up costs and so on but due to my very limited finances am unable to get the funds together to start the business. So, I am stuck in a leading to nowhere position with a capped salary and no hope for the furture. This is why I am considering insuracne sales.

 

I hope I did not leave anyone out I know there were others but I don't think they had any questions.

 

As it stands now I am still in my loser job and still trying to figure a way out of it.

 

Peace

[Guest DevonSFescort]

>I have considered Las Vegas as a possible alternative and actually >sent a few resumes out in that city.

 

That could be a very promising way to go. It's one of the leading cities in terms of job creation right now; land is cheap and (I think) the desert really is an enchanting place. On the other hand it's a very transient town and quite a few people have told me there's something ruthless about the culture; the stereotype is that people are mainly interested in using one another, and it can be difficult to find community. I remember seeing on the local news the first day I visited there that Vegas leads the nation in suicides (something to consider if depression is an issue and/or you're vulnerable to isolation). But my impression is that a lot of that revolves around the casino culture, which you don't have to participate in.

 

>I also need to put in a disclaimer here as some will probably

>dislike me due to my occupation but I understand that it is

>considered very negative to many of you.

 

Join the club. }( :+

[Guest DevonSFescort]

>Though the places where I would like to live Portland or Seattle >don't have many positions in my current field.

 

Unfortunately it doesn't sound like they have many positions across the board, judging by these unemployment figures, which admittedly are state-by-state rather than city-by-city. But from what I understand the Pacific Northwest is the hardest hit region in the country.

 

http://money.cnn.com/pf/features/lists/state_unemployment/

 

And other big issue to consider when weighing career choices is the likelihood that whatever job you choose will stick around or be vulnerable to outsourcing, now that more than just manufacturing jobs and the like can be replicated inexpensively elsewhere:

 

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2004/03/07/BUGMJ5FARN1.DTL

 

Silicon Valley, for instance is expected to lose 1 in 6 jobs to outsourcing as overseas labor markets include more and more highly skilled workers who are cheaper to employ than their American (especially their Bay Area) counterparts. The only thing likely to make up for that trend is another surge in innovation -- now that workers in India and elsewhere are so well educated and have high tech skills, we need American high tech to go "higher tech."

[HooBoy]

A collection agency?

 

So what?

 

If you Love what you do, then do it.

 

You say the start up costs are too great.

 

You are starting with a "I cannot do it" attitude.

 

You're 51 years old. You either roll the dice or stick where are you are.

 

Or can learn to say, "Would you like fries with that?"

 

Dear Sky...don't be Grey ...

 

That's just my two cents worth,.

 

That and two bucks will get you a ride on a NYC bus.

 

Good luck and I hope you get off the pity pot, because you're taking up my space. lol

 

(The edit is simply to clarify a joke of mine that I am on the pity pot and it's getting crowded. I was not trying to make him feel worse.)

__

 

The above written as a regular guy, not the owner of a website and has no official meaning, just unofficial BS.)

__

 

--garbo the hoo

[BigK]

Are there some smaller owner operated collection agencies in your area? Maybe if you schedule some meet and greets with the owners you might find one nearing or desiring retirement. If you know the industry and click with this person suggest an arrangement where you come to work in a management capacity to free up a little of the owners time while entering into a buy/sell agreement to purchase his business over time. You could take less compensation up front and apply the difference to the eventual purchase of the business. Instead of financial capital you have knowledge capital. There is someone out there. Enjoy the hunt. 3-5 years to purchase the business...10-15 years to run it...and then you find another you at where you are now to sell the business to.

 

Just brainstorming.

 

BigK

[OneFinger]

CrackTheGraySky,

 

Collections is a really tough business and it sure isn't good on your stress level. I understand there's quite a bit of turn-over in that field and I'm amazed anyone could survive more than a couple years doing that job. You've got to be quite a person to handle it. My stomach would be tied in knots.

 

But, I do have another suggestion. I've heard a lot of excellent reports on a couple of books by Dan Miller. They are "48 Days to Creative Income" and "48 Days to the Work You Love". Here's a website link:

 

http://48days.com/

 

Don't know if they are available at your local library but it's worth checking.

 

Good luck and I'd hope our paths do cross some day.

[Guest 10cc]

You are in a great positon crack gray. You are in a recession proof industry that will always have enough business. Being in it so long you surely know the ins and outs. Like some said give your skills a try, take a fucking chjance and open your own agency, maybe hooboy can send you some business the next time a sponsor's check bounces

 

Well just my though but remember with your experience even if you try and can't make it work on your own then with your experience you should be able to get the same type of job you have now so you have a reasonable back up if it doesnt work out.

[Guest CrackTheGraySky]

Once again many thanks especially to Devon, Hooboy, Onefinger and Bigk. Your encouragement is truly appreciated.

 

While I still have much planning to do I think I will use my knowledge to start a small collection agency. I understand the business, have been doing it for years, and have some artwork and a small amount in my 401k ( I didn't start one till 2 years ago )to get me started. I also have some collectable stuff, maybe I can try to sell them on the Internet possibly Ebay.

 

At my age it is about time I did something to benefit myself instead of others. All these years of working for little income seems so wasted now. I should have stayed with what I seem to know best and gone on my own a long time ago. Now I am affraid that maybe it is too late but I think I must take the chance.

 

Before I dive in I need to determine if I am gong to move to Las Vegas. The cost of living is very reasonable there and most likely it would make sense to start a business in a city I enjoy and due to the lower cost of living I will maximize the little money I will have.

 

I know this site is about escorts and clients and yes I am a client that is how I found the site but you guys in this thread and my other two have been really great, I appreciate all of you and also I need to mention jackhammer who reached out to me when I was very depressed while he was basically packing for Rio. I didn't take advantage of his offer but his kindness was not forgotten.

 

OK I am going on too much now. Thanks and I will be around.

 

RM

[HooBoy]

Go to Vegas - Go to the Mandalay Bay, in the Baccarat Room. Sit at the table for an hour and track the trend. When you feel confident that you notice a trend (and watch the Asians - when they have the same feeling) put down $10,000 on one bet.

 

If you win, get up and leave. If you lose, well, better luck next time. Baccarat has the best odds in the casino and they will let you sit at the table for hours and not make one bet. I just cruise the boys cause the game is so easy you do not have to concentrate or be able to do math.

 

All it takes is one, the right one. When it gets really fun is when you have $1,000 on the TIE bet which pays 8 - 1 and hits.

 

Remember to tip the dealer very well. A thousand buck tip will make a dealer very happy and if he is cute...

__

 

The above written as a regular guy, not the owner of a website and has no official meaning, just unofficial BS.)

__

 

--garbo the hoo

[bigguyinpasadena]

Dear GreySkies(I was going to start this"dearest crack"but that sounded rude)The one place I would advise AGAINST your moving to is Las Vegas.You deal with peoples money troubles, have people giving you hard luck stories,get lied to,get beat up on(abusive phone calls that is)every day-do you want to double your misery?

The biz you are in IS,unfortunatly,a growth industry.Have you thought about doing some freelance work on your off hours?Lots of small buisness people don't want the hassle of trying to collect small debts on their own-but are horrified at the percentage of the big boys want to charge-and therefore either try the small claims route(big headache-and often a waste of time)or just let the matter drop.

I would imagine you need to get some sort of buisness licence for this,and file some papers-but otherwise it is something you might want to try.

Insurance sales sounds ok-but it also sounds like a lot of work for your check and also you really have to be willing to be on the clock 24/7 in order to get all the buisness that might come your way.I hate waiting to here back from insurance salesmen-and will often give my policies to anyone who gets baqck to me soonest-or,wonder of wonders,actually answers the phone in person!

But unless you are debt free,have some savings(cash at hand-not art,investments,ebay,knickknacs)enough to last you 6 months(this used to be 3-but with the job picture not so rosey right now,,,)and have the intestinal fortitude to start from scratch at 51-then stay put and find some outlets to get you out of yourself.