Amtrak train derails killing 6 people; our aging infrastructure keeps killing Americans.

[marylander1940]

Daylight on Wednesday revealed the destruction and devastation caused by an Amtrak train derailment in Philadelphia that left at least six people dead and injured dozens more, several critically, as survivors recalled a terrifying wreck that plunged them into darkness and chaos.

 

Some passengers had to scramble through the windows of toppled cars to escape. One of the seven cars was completely mangled.

 

The accident closed the nation's busiest rail corridor between New York and Washington as federal investigators begin sifting through the twisted remains to determine what went wrong.

 

Train 188, a Northeast Regional, left Washington, D.C. and was headed to New York when it derailed shortly after 9 p.m. Tuesday. Amtrak said the train was carrying 238 passengers and five crew members.

 

More:

 

http://news.yahoo.com/amtrak-train-derails-killing-5-people-investigation-begins-073410531--finance.html

 

http://encyclopedia.creepyhollows.com/images/ci_angel_weeping.jpg

[AdamSmith]

Whether or not a railbed failure was the cause, one can hope this accident raises the public discussion of decaying infrastructure. But it almost certainly won't.

 

This chart is not exactly what I was looking for but it does tell part of the story:

 

http://media.economist.com/images/images-magazine/2011/04/30/us/20110430_usc609.gif

 

What I was looking for was a picture of U.S. infrastructure expenditures showing new construction vs. maintenance/repair. In a developed country like ours, it should be vastly weighted toward maintenance/repair. But of course it is still the other way around. We spend far more on new--and, in our well built out nation, increasingly superfluous--infrastructure projects than we do on maintaining the roads, bridges, tunnels, rail networks, etc. that we already have. (The above chart appears to contradict this, but I think it does not tell the whole story. Further research in progress now.)

 

The reasons are clear. Congresspeople get much more credit for bringing home a highly visible new construction project than for funding maintenance, which is a largely invisible expenditure--until something fails. And for the construction industry, new construction is much more lucrative than maintenance/repair. So the perfect storm for letting our infrastructure go to hell.

[+ WilliamM]

I live in Philadelphia. Horrible situation because there still may be people trapped in the cars of the train. It's amazing that a few of the passengers are still giving interviews on TV. Former U.S. Representative Patrick Murphy has been up all night, now he is close to braking down in tears. I guess this is typical: Murphy says that some passengers thought of themselves first and pushed aside people who were badly hurt. Many, many others thought of the people in major distress first -- before themselves. [Murphy was in the U.S. Army, and served in Iraq and Bosnia.]

[+ WmClarke]

Just awful.

 

There is a lot of maintenance/upgrading going on in my area. Sadly, I think it's due to the I-35 bridge collapse in Minneapolis a few years ago. Every time I bitch about the annoying construction, I (literally, verbally out loud) remind myself that we need this work done and to quit my bitching.

[AdamSmith]

Agree 1000%. I wrote an article for a civil engineering journal about the I-35 collapse a few months after it happened. Part of the research was interviewing engineers and surveyors who worked on site immediately afterward, doing data collection for the engineering forensics into what went wrong. They described having to stop work and leave the site out of respect and privacy, each time a body was about to be recovered by the diving team. They all fervently hoped the scale and shock of the tragedy would spur investment in infrastructure upkeep, but none of them really expected much to change.

 

Thinking back over research I've seen in the past, even if the Economist chart above is correct, the spending ratios are still out of whack. With the U.S.'s current state of infrastructure buildout, engineering consensus is that maintenance/repair should be about 75% of our total annual infrastructure spending, with new construction about 25%.

[rvwnsd]

Whether or not a railbed failure was the cause, one can hope this accident raises the public discussion of decaying infrastructure. But it almost certainly won't.

 

This chart is not exactly what I was looking for but it does tell part of the story:

 

http://media.economist.com/images/images-magazine/2011/04/30/us/20110430_usc609.gif

 

What I was looking for was a picture of U.S. infrastructure expenditures showing new construction vs. maintenance/repair. In a developed country like ours, it should be vastly weighted toward maintenance/repair. But of course it is still the other way around. We spend far more on new--and, in our well built out nation, increasingly superfluous--infrastructure projects than we do on maintaining the roads, bridges, tunnels, rail networks, etc. that we already have. (The above chart appears to contradict this, but I think it does not tell the whole story. Further research in progress now.)

 

The reasons are clear. Congresspeople get much more credit for bringing home a highly visible new construction project than for funding maintenance, which is a largely invisible expenditure--until something fails. And for the construction industry, new construction is much more lucrative than maintenance/repair. So the perfect storm for letting our infrastructure go to hell.

 

I agree with you regarding the horrible state of US infrastructure. One thing worth mentioning is that railroad rights-of-way are often owned and maintained by private railroad corporations who lease the right-of-way to Amtrak. The owner, not Amtrak, is responsible for track and railbed maintenance. That being said, regardless who did or did not maintain the right-of-way a few hundred people were injured and at least six people died. If this was an airline the outcry would be deafening.

[AdamSmith]

Agree. It's amazing the trains run even as well as they do, given the state of trackage here. Causes despair to go to Europe and see their micron-precision rail engineering.

[+ dutchmuch]

Below is a 4 year old estimate:

 

With talk of trimming the defense budget floating about Washington, lawmakers are eager to nail down what's being spent where but despite their best efforts, answers are proving hard to find.

 

Stars And Stripes reports that as of May 2011, U.S. efforts in Afghanistan and Iraq totaled $9.7 billion a month, or roughly the entire annual budget of The Environmental Protection Agency.

 

 

 

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/money-spent-in-afghanistan-could-buy-at-home-2011-8#ixzz3a2FgJ5ce

[AdamSmith]

There it is. Given that economic security is the foundation of national security, did those two wars really make us more secure, or immeasurably less so?

[bigvalboy]

Our failing infrastructure not withstanding. Is this another case of operator error? Do we have yet another speeding train going too fast on a curve?*..... With the recent airline crashes that at least initially appear to be pilot error, do we now have to worry who is at the controls every time we climb aboard...anything?

 

*viewing video, CNN reporting that it might have been going 100 mph in a 50 mph zone.

[AdamSmith]

do we now have to worry who is at the controls every time we climb aboard...anything?

 

Don't you already?

 

But reality check. We gladly barrel down the highway every day on nothing but a wing & a prayer that dozens/hundreds of oncoming drivers will maintain those precious few inches of separation between them and us. The odds of being involved in a public-transport operator disaster are vanishingly small compared with getting maimed or snuffed on the way to the grocery.

[bigvalboy]

Not until recently, lol...naive? Perhaps, but I used to never give it a second thought. Now every time I pass the pilot (on my way to first class) I just wonder to myself if he is not some kind of nut case who has no business riding a bike much less flying a plane.

 

 

AND...actually I don't barrel down anything. LOL...I haven't been on a freeway in over a year, but I get where your going, and you are absolutely correct. I've seen the stats, and driving is far more dangerous.

[+ FreshFluff]

Not until recently, lol...naive? Perhaps, but I used to never give it a second thought. Now every time I pass the pilot (on my way to first class) I just wonder to myself if he is not some kind of nut case who has no business riding a bike much less flying a plane.

 

I've started saying hello to the pilots after getting permission from the FA. It's unclear what the point is, and as many people are probably doing the same,, I'm sure the flight crew is tired of it. But it makes me feel better.

[bigvalboy]

I've started saying hello to the pilots after getting permission from the FA. It's unclear what the point is, and as many people are probably doing the same,, I'm sure the flight crew is tired of it. But it makes me feel better.

 

As do I....and yes, for some reason it does make me feel better.

[rguer]

Reports I've read today say that the accident was on the Northeast Corridor, which is mostly owned by Amtrak. I have not read whether that particular stretch is owned and maintained by Amtrak.

 

Also, it seems that the train was going 100 mph on a curve with a 50 mph speed limit.

[+ WilliamM]

Living in Philly, it was interesting to watch the national coverage on CNN and MSNBC (did not watch Fox News).

 

The hosts and reporters made very few mistakes. Initially they were reporting the accident was north of the city, not in the city. And Rachel Maddow forgot that Pennsylvania elected a new governor in November (Tom Wolf -- Democrat).

That is amazing considering they had virtually no time to prepare. Overall, I believe MSNBC did the better job.

 

Note: I also should mention how the city came together: the residents of the Post Richmond part of the city most of all. Also: the hospitals, police, fire, Mayor Nutter, Amtrak. More people would have died without such a quick and effective response.

[BSR]

Also, it seems that the train was going 100 mph on a curve with a 50 mph speed limit.

That's the headline that made my eyes pop. Even an impeccably maintained track won't prevent a disaster if the conductor is going double the speed limit around a curve. Going a hundred in a fifty?? And what exactly was the reason for THAT?!

[bigvalboy]

That's the headline that made my eyes pop. Even an impeccably maintained track won't prevent a disaster if the conductor is going double the speed limit around a curve. Going a hundred in a fifty?? And what exactly was the reason for THAT?!

 

That's the "64,ooo dollar" question, and the track was inspected just prior. If it was operator error let's keep the focus on the problem, and not divert it.

[marylander1940]

[bigvalboy]

 

"A thousand years from now, they're going to dig this place up, and they will marvel at how we lived"

[BabyBoomer]

Latest from NTSB: Train was traveling at 106mph as it headed toward curve where speed limit was 50mph. Engineer applied emergency brake, but it was too late.

 

~Boomer ~

[+ WmClarke]

Latest from NTSB: Train was traveling at 106mph as it headed toward curve where speed limit was 50mph. Engineer applied emergency brake, but it was too late.

 

~Boomer ~

 

Holy crap. :(

[bigvalboy]

http://media.cmgdigital.com/shared/lt/lt_cache/aresize/835x529/img/photos/2015/05/13/0d/99/BrandonBostian.jpg

 

Seven gone....may they rest in peace...200 injured, some still critical. PTC...positive train control

[+ ArVaGuy]

Latest from NTSB: Train was traveling at 106mph as it headed toward curve where speed limit was 50mph. Engineer applied emergency brake, but it was too late.

 

~Boomer ~

 

A train derailing while traveling twice the posted speed into a curve is not an infrastructure issue. It's a matter of the engineer not performing his job well at all. Poor training could be a factor, but it's just as likely the engineer was distracted, intoxicated, incompetent, or negligent. The fact that the engineer has refused to cooperate with the initial investigation leads me to conclude there is much more to this tradegy than the media is capable of reporting.

 

Why deal in facts, especially when little is known at this point, when you can jump to conclusions and use the event for political gain? Yes, our infrastructure needs an overhaul, but we've been aware of that fact for decades. Throwing money at the issue is not prudent under the circumstances with out a strategy and long term plan.

[OneFinger]

This is another example of why Positive Train Control (PTC) needs to be implemented ASAP. PTC is a system that would automatically turn off an engine if it blew past a stop signal or was traveling too fast before a curve. A law was put in place requiring PTC by the end of 2015. But, that deadline is not going to be met.

 

There is a proposed bill to extend that deadline until 2020. Until PTC is reality, there will be more accidents due to human error / distraction.