Social versus sexual time

[unsub2O17]

My attorney is an excellent attorney, and I've used him for 30 years. He is also a great golfer and a fun and interesting dinner companion. He always bills me for any professional time involving legal advice that he gives me, but he's never expected or asked me to pay his legal fee while playing golf with me. And we usually split the dinner bill--again no legal fee involved. I gather the fee rules for escorts are different? Escorts' fees are for ANY time that they would spend with me no matter what the activity is?? This is OK. I'm just trying to get this straight in my head, and I do realize that there's no fixed rule, and that certain escorts may change this rule for certain clients. I'm just trying to get a fix on the general consensus.

[seeker630]

My attorney is an excellent attorney, and I've used him for 30 years. He is also a great golfer and a fun and interesting dinner companion. He always bills me for any professional time involving legal advice that he gives me, but he's never expected or asked me to pay his legal fee while playing golf with me. And we usually split the dinner bill--again no legal fee involved. I gather the fee rules for escorts are different? Escorts' fees are for ANY time that they would spend with me no matter what the activity is?? This is OK. I'm just trying to get this straight in my head, and I do realize that there's no fixed rule, and that certain escorts may change this rule for certain clients. I'm just trying to get a fix on the general consensus.

 

unsub, with respect - what difference does the 'general consensus' here make when, as you acknowledge, each escort makes his own policy? I think you have your own view of how it should be, and that's your right; if an escort's policy doesn't agree, you can either walk away or choose to accept the policy.

 

I am curious about your social relationship with your attorney - who initiates the golfing & dinners, and how did this relationship get started? Do you consider him/her a friend?

 

I don't have an attorney, but your relationship sounds uncommon to me. (I'm sure other posters can educate me on this. )

[jjkrkwood]

You have stated so clearly that you don't hire for anything but the act of blowing large cock. So WTF did you decide to become the authority on whether or not escorts should or shouldn't have dinner on or off the clock? Thats a decision for the escort and the client, not for his self-anointed highness the moral authority of this website. Who is to say that an escorts off the clock dinner won't result in a 7 day African safari booking. Are you going to castrate a movie casting director because she might make a celebrity audition for a role unpaid? That audition may very well lead to a job.

 

+1 Seeker 630.. You nailed this one. What disrespect, what venom. I think you owe the client you refer to a real apology jj!

 

I know thinking is difficult for you DTB, but you should really pay attention if you are gonna try to contradict what I say. I have stated my views on escort FREE time... its Bullshit, but I also consistently said that the escort should be asked and the decision WILL be his. I stand by that, and with that said I owe noone Nothing.... and what a ridiculous comment, a movie casting director is a paid employee, doing her assigned job, not an independent contractor fending for himself. Where do you see ANY comparision here ? Good try here DTB, but no cigar for you ! Trying to be smart is not your strong suit. :o

[jjkrkwood]

My attorney is an excellent attorney, and I've used him for 30 years. He is also a great golfer and a fun and interesting dinner companion. He always bills me for any professional time involving legal advice that he gives me, but he's never expected or asked me to pay his legal fee while playing golf with me. And we usually split the dinner bill--again no legal fee involved. I gather the fee rules for escorts are different? Escorts' fees are for ANY time that they would spend with me no matter what the activity is?? This is OK. I'm just trying to get this straight in my head, and I do realize that there's no fixed rule, and that certain escorts may change this rule for certain clients. I'm just trying to get a fix on the general consensus.

 

Look unsub, I am not sure why you are beating a dead horse here, but it all boils down to whether your targeted escorts want to be friends or social with you. the only way you will find out is to ask them. Constantly making comparisons to other people and professions has no bearing on what the individual escort will want or say.... We all get it. you feel worthy of the escorts friendship, you think you are a smart, witty, warm person that ANYONE would want to be friends with. You feel you can enhance his life. OK, so dont tell us, tell him and see if he Agrees.

[unsub2O17]

unsub, with respect - what difference does the 'general consensus' here make when, as you acknowledge, each escort makes his own policy? I think you have your own view of how it should be, and that's your right; if an escort's policy doesn't agree, you can either walk away or choose to accept the policy.

 

I am curious about your social relationship with your attorney - who initiates the golfing & dinners, and how did this relationship get started? Do you consider him/her a friend?

 

I don't have an attorney, but your relationship sounds uncommon to me. (I'm sure other posters can educate me on this. )

 

Seeker, you are absolutely right. "Consensus" was an inapplicable word here. It's kind of like the issue of tipping, isn't it? Different strokes for different folks.

[unsub2O17]

Look unsub, I am not sure why you are beating a dead horse here, but it all boils down to whether your targeted escorts want to be friends or social with you. the only way you will find out is to ask them. Constantly making comparisons to other people and professions has no bearing on what the individual escort will want or say.... We all get it. you feel worthy of the escorts friendship, you think you are a smart, witty, warm person that ANYONE would want to be friends with. You feel you can enhance his life. OK, so dont tell us, tell him and see if he Agrees.

 

Fair enough. The horse is officially dead!

[bigvalboy]

I am curious about your social relationship with your attorney - who initiates the golfing & dinners, and how did this relationship get started? Do you consider him/her a friend?

 

I don't have an attorney, but your relationship sounds uncommon to me. (I'm sure other posters can educate me on this.

 

While I have been reading with interest unsub's posts, I had to laugh this morning as I have a great relationship with my attorney. Well one of them that is. I am not sure how uncommon my relationship is, but we began to socialize early on. He had completed a minor case for me involving a parking ticket I received on a car that was parked, I thought on private property, the city thought otherwise. We lost the case in court, and as we walked out of court he said to me, "well if we were in Bangkok, none of this would have mattered, you can park anywhere in that city" I asked if he had been, and he said I am leaving next week. I said I go all the time also, and he invited me to join he and his friends. That started years of travel together, and countless invites to use his beach house in Laguna.

 

I never once thought this as being odd or out of the norm. To me it was a natural friendship that just developed. I would imagine that much of it has to do with two people clicking personality wise. He is hilarious to be around, and much of his attitude about life is shared by myself also.

 

I don't look at people or put people in categories, or see them as, well that's my attorney, or he is an escort, so a personal relationship would be odd. Perhaps that is why I spend time with and have invited escorts to socialize off the clock. An escort recently asked if he could come to FTL, as he had never been. I plan on paying his expenses, but I never once thought that he expected me to pay for his time as well. He was even delighted when I insisted on paying for his airfare. He was just happy to come to FTL and hang out on the boat. I have never paid for that social time, and only once in all the years that I have been hiring, has an escort said to me, "I would love to go with you Bob, but remember I am 200 dollars an hour" I thanked him for his honesty, and just moved on. I have asked numerous escorts as well, if they charge for social time, most do not...

[bigvalboy]

Fair enough. The horse is officially dead!

 

Unsub, the only way that you can learn or understand is to have discussion. Only you can decide when that discussion should end. If someone is tired of hearing about it, let them move on. If you are unclear about something or still have questions, then by all means, continue to ask. That is what this M-F is here for.

[jjkrkwood]

Unsub, the only way that you can learn or understand is to have discussion. Only you can decide when that discussion should end. If someone is tired of hearing about it, let them move on. If you are unclear about something or still have questions, then by all means, continue to ask. That is what this M-F is here for.

 

If memory serves me correctly BVB, you yourself have called for many discussions to be terminated and threads to be locked ? Are YOU the one that makes those decisions on this board ?

For unsub to Learn, tell him why YOU didnt just move on .......... In fact we are all curious Now... ( and I use the same "we" you use when tossings stats about this boards members around, ie: WE are all tired of this Trolls behavior and agree its destroying our enjoyment here)...

[seeker630]

BVB, thanks for sharing your experience. I did not mean to imply that social relationships with one's attorney, etc. would be odd, but I did think it would not be that common. Perhaps I am wrong. And some of us are more outgoing/open than others.

[bigvalboy]

If memory serves me correctly BVB, you yourself have called for many discussions to be terminated and threads to be locked ? Are YOU the one that makes those decisions on this board ?

For unsub to Learn, tell him why YOU didnt just move on .......... In fact we are all curious Now... ( and I use the same "we" you use when tossings stats about this boards members around, ie: WE are all tired of this Trolls behavior and agree its destroying our enjoyment here)...

 

OMG...You are really funny jj...I am beginning to think that you are really a little crazy? LOL LOL LOL Oh dear God!!

[jjkrkwood]

OMG...You are really funny jj...I am beginning to think that you are really a little crazy? LOL LOL LOL Oh dear God!!

 

Uh-huh, interesting comment, yet I dont hear any denial, because you Cant... Lets face it BVB, you have always felt "entitled" here, and work overtime to recruit others to back up your sneaky behavior..with your pvt messages and sending people posts. But I guess the joke is on you, since some of your "trusted confidants" really aint your friends. The reason we clash is because you havent been able to fool me. And thats just part of your game. so before you go around calling people "crazy" a little reflection might serve you well. ? Now countdown 1-2-3 seconds. Start pvt messaging.

[bigvalboy]

Perhaps I am wrong. And some of us are more outgoing/open than others.

 

No, not so wrong Seek, but you do make an excellent observation, when you say that some of us are more outgoing/open than others. I was visiting a friend of mine not long ago in another city. I talked to everyone I met, waiters, cab drivers, tour bus operators, people on the plane etc. When I got off the plane and went down stairs to claim luggage, I ran into my friend who was meeting me and also a lady that was sitting next to me on the plane. She and I had begun talking in LA and talked 5 hours clear across the country. In the end, I knew all about her life, her aging mother, her kids, she told me all about her husband and their marriage of 30 plus years etc....LOL LOL we hugged, I wished her well, and we said our goodbyes. My friend just looked at me and said, "do you talk to everybody you meet?" I just laughed, and I said, "Yes I do" I find people really fascinating, he just shook his head. Now I have my moments, but by and large I usually am very engaging with people.

[unsub2O17]

BVB, thanks for sharing your experience. I did not mean to imply that social relationships with one's attorney, etc. would be odd, but I did think it would be not be that common. Perhaps I am wrong. And some of us are more outgoing/open than others.

 

Sorry, I forgot to answer that part of your question/comment. Actually, we had a strictly professional relationship for about 20 years. Then, to me, out of the blue, at the end of our regular meeting, HE said, "we should have dinner sometime". I said "fine", and that was the beginning of both a continued professional and an additional social relationship. I definitely consider him a friend.

[bigvalboy]

yet I dont hear any denial, because you Cant...

 

What are you talking about, what am I suppose to be denying?

 

Lets face it BVB, you have always felt "entitled" here,

 

Absolutely not true, I have never felt enttiled, here or anywhere else in my life.

 

 

and work overtime to recruit others to back up your sneaky behavior..with your pvt messages and sending people posts.

 

The amount of time I spend here is minimal in compared to my daily life. I dare say in compared to the time you spend here..

and when is sending someone a private message considered "sneaky behavior"

 

But I guess the joke is on you, since some of your "trusted confidants" really aint your friends.

 

There isn't anyone on this message forum that I would consider my "trusted confidant" and certainly no one that I would categorize as a "friend" except one person....and he and I only use email.

 

The reason we clash is because you havent been able to fool me.

 

Do you seriously think that I sit around trying to fool you? really? LOL

 

And thats just part of your game.

 

Game? to me this is not a game to me. Casual entertainment perhaps, but nothing more.

 

 

so before you go around calling people "crazy" a little reflection might serve you well. ? Now countdown 1-2-3 seconds. Start pvt messaging.

 

I hope you are not waiting for me to send you a private message...I have many things on my agenda today, and a day full of communicating with you is certainly not on that list...

[seeker630]

Sorry, I forgot to answer that part of your question/comment. Actually, we had a strictly professional relationship for about 20 years. Then, to me, out of the blue, at the end of our regular meeting, HE said, "we should have dinner sometime". I said "fine", and that was the beginning of both a continued professional and an additional social relationship. I definitely consider him a friend.

 

Thanks for that - I really was curious.

 

And, the more friends, the better!

[jjkrkwood]

I hope you are not waiting for me to send you a private message...I have many things on my agenda today, and a day full of communicating with you is certainly not on that list...

 

Your "agenda" is always the same, sitting here and gossiping via pvt with the other Keebler Elves, regardless of what you would "like" us to believe about your full, lush life.... Smoke and mirrors.

[Juan Vancouver]

My attorney is an excellent attorney, and I've used him for 30 years. He is also a great golfer and a fun and interesting dinner companion. He always bills me for any professional time involving legal advice that he gives me, but he's never expected or asked me to pay his legal fee while playing golf with me. And we usually split the dinner bill--again no legal fee involved. I gather the fee rules for escorts are different? Escorts' fees are for ANY time that they would spend with me no matter what the activity is?? This is OK. I'm just trying to get this straight in my head, and I do realize that there's no fixed rule, and that certain escorts may change this rule for certain clients. I'm just trying to get a fix on the general consensus.

 

Unsub,

 

There will never be general consensus, and that's for the better. There are men who charge for having sex, there are men who charge for their time. There are men who look for a prepared, engaging, professional companion and are excited about finding a professional, there are men who are looking to spend time with people an will be excited to find a bargain. All of these are great. But not everyone does everything.

 

You should not be offended if I turn down your invitation. While your lawyer charges you for his lawyering, I am in the business of spending time with people. I, as well as many other men who have honed their skills, am in the business of spending time with people.

 

Spending time with me without wanting to pay my fee is like getting lawyering from your lawyer without wanting to pay his.

 

Some men, some of them as wonderful and skilful as the most, charge mostly for the sex they have with you. They will not only accept your invitation, they will be excited that you may pick up the check at the end. Time you spend with them is not lawyering time, only the actually sex is.

 

A sex escort spending time with you doesn't mean he especially adores you. A time for money escort not wanting to spend free time with you doesn't mean he finds you revolting. Those are two entirely different professions and hopefully they both work well for each. They are not impacted by your personal worth in any way.

 

Everyone does business different. Even if we call everyone escorts, not everyone is in the same profession. And that is great. We need that variety. Serious clients looking to hire a professional companion will understand my way of working and will be excited about finding me. Clients who are excited to spend free time will always have hot guys with whom they can hang out.

 

As long as we keep using the same word to describe both professions you will have to expect to ask and negotiate every single time. That is just the way things are.

[bigvalboy]

Your "agenda" is always the same,

 

Again, I have never had an "agenda" I do not view this M-F as important enough to even think about developing one.

 

sitting here and gossiping via pvt with the other Keebler Elves

,

 

 

I rarely if ever "gossip" about anything. Discussions via private messages are generally limited to chit chat about how the latest trip was or what is going on with someones day, or talking about business or discussing personal issues that members are having to deal with. That is what the PM feature is for.

 

 

regardless of what you would "like" us to believe about your full, lush life

 

 

Who is this "us" you speak about, sounds a little self aboded to me. I have never cared what you or anyone else thought about my life. My life for the most part is very personal, despite the few bits of information you have gathered and now somehow decide that you have all the pieces to the puzzle. Members that I have met on a one on one basis, we discuss a wide range of topics. Usually I am more interested in what they are about.

 

.... Smoke and mirrors

 

For those that have allowed me into their life, I am an open book. That is why friendships last as long as they do.

 

 

And with that my dear Jirkwood...class is adjorned for the day. I have things to do, and you have a bus to catch.

[unsub2O17]

Unsub,

 

There will never be general consensus, and that's for the better. There are men who charge for having sex, there are men who charge for their time. There are men who look for a prepared, engaging, professional companion and are excited about finding a professional, there are men who are looking to spend time with people an will be excited to find a bargain. All of these are great. But not everyone does everything.

 

You should not be offended if I turn down your invitation. While your lawyer charges you for his lawyering, I am in the business of spending time with people. I, as well as many other men who have honed their skills, am in the business of spending time with people.

 

Spending time with me without wanting to pay my fee is like getting lawyering from your lawyer without wanting to pay his.

 

Some men, some of them as wonderful and skilful as the most, charge mostly for the sex they have with you. They will not only accept your invitation, they will be excited that you may pick up the check at the end. Time you spend with them is not lawyering time, only the actually sex is.

 

A sex escort spending time with you doesn't mean he especially adores you. A time for money escort not wanting to spend free time with you doesn't mean he finds you revolting. Those are two entirely different professions and hopefully they both work well for each. They are not impacted by your personal worth in any way.

 

Everyone does business different. Even if we call everyone escorts, not everyone is in the same profession. And that is great. We need that variety. Serious clients looking to hire a professional companion will understand my way of working and will be excited about finding me. Clients who are excited to spend free time will always have hot guys with whom they can hang out.

 

As long as we keep using the same word to describe both professions you will have to expect to ask and negotiate every single time. That is just the way things are.

 

Thank you, Juan. I DO understand this.

[raulgmanzo]

Not sex vs social but rather client focused vs unfocused

 

My attorney ... always bills me for any professional time involving legal advice that he gives me, but he's never expected or asked me to pay his legal fee while playing golf with me....

 

...While your lawyer charges you for his lawyering, I am in the business of spending time with people. I, as well as many other men who have honed their skills, am in the business of spending time with people.

 

Spending time with me without wanting to pay my fee is like getting lawyering from your lawyer without wanting to pay his.

...

 

Hmmm, well the lawyer probably charges FOR HIS TIME also but only the time spent being a lawyer.

I can't speak for anyone else but in my case I charge for time spent being a focused companion and that may be sex, dinner or both.

 

During the time I am on the clock whatever we do whether dick or dinner is going to revolve around me trying to show the client a good time. Which not only is good for business but does indeed give me immense professional satisfaction.

 

However I do spent a lot of unpaid time with clients but in those cases I might not defer to his tastes. Perhaps I want to try a Somali restaurant for which his city is famous, or am not in the mood for getting my dick sucked or maybe I'm going to wear my jock strap while we play even though you prefer a speedo or nothing.

 

Within the bounds of courteous, consensual comprompise or collaboration I am free to act on my own desires and social/sexual/recreational/gastronomic needs and urges while off the clock.

 

Now one of the things that makes sex with a client often really hot is that having a sexual (or social) role can actually be quite liberating and rewarding.

 

I feel very lucky to have a variety of friends, clients, and fuckbuddies and make no apologies for the fact that there is some overlap.

[raulgmanzo]

...Now one of the things that makes sex with a client often really hot is that having a sexual (or social) role can actually be quite liberating and rewarding....

 

Just to be clear when I talk about roles that is being ON the clock.

 

Also I have hundreds of friends, dozens of relatives and several neighbors for whom I desperately wish I had more time to spend. Alternatively I could be earning some money with another appointment.

 

So while I greatly enjoy unpaid time with a client it is sometimes better for me to use that time to catch up with the rest of my life and hundreds of projects. So if I don't want to stick around for dinner it is probably nothing to do with the client and more with my problem of being involved in too many things and not managing my time as well as I should.

[Bosguy]

Hmmm, well the lawyer probably charges FOR HIS TIME also but only the time spent being a lawyer.

I can't speak for anyone else but in my case I charge for time spent being a focused companion and that may be sex, dinner or both.

 

During the time I am on the clock whatever we do whether dick or dinner is going to revolve around me trying to show the client a good time. Which not only is good for business but does indeed give me immense professional satisfaction.

 

However I do spent a lot of unpaid time with clients but in those cases I might not defer to his tastes. Perhaps I want to try a Somali restaurant for which his city is famous, or am not in the mood for getting my dick sucked or maybe I'm going to wear my jock strap while we play even though you prefer a speedo or nothing.

 

Within the bounds of courteous, consensual comprompise or collaboration I am free to act on my own desires and social/sexual/recreational/gastronomic needs and urges while off the clock.

 

Now one of the things that makes sex with a client often really hot is that having a sexual (or social) role can actually be quite liberating and rewarding.

 

I feel very lucky to have a variety of friends, clients, and fuckbuddies and make no apologies for the fact that there is some overlap.

 

Thank you Raul for a perfect word to describe my feeling on this subect---OVERLAP

 

Boston Bill

[bigvalboy]

I feel very lucky to have a variety of friends, clients, and fuckbuddies and make no apologies for the fact that there is some overlap.

 

Whew...for a brief moment there, I thought that you might be sending me a bill for the hourly rate of the dinner we shared in Chicago...LOL LOL Which was most enjoyable, by the way....and if I was to return, you can be sure that I would hire you as my tour guide, despite the fact that on some level I believe we have transcended that client/escort relationship.

[Guest countryboywny]

Thank you Raul for a perfect word to describe my feeling on this subect---OVERLAP

 

Boston Bill

 

Yes, well said Raul! ..but who would expect anything else from a real PRO like you!