Client Reviews

[Guest ript4hire]

Fellow Workin' Boys,

 

I am in talks with a web programmer friend of mine to put together a

new escort website. It will have similar functionality to RentBoy

and the others, but one of the new features will be a client

review database.

 

He wanted me to get some opinions - to see if you think that

something like this would be useful, and if you would contribute to

it, etc. He is going over ways to keep ALL client contact info

confidential ... so no one's privacy would be violated. We just

want to give escorts a tool so when they show up at that hotel room

door ... they have SOME idea of who is waiting on the other side!

 

Thoughts?

 

Eric

[Boston Guy]

Eric,

 

I understand that your post was directed, reasonably, at fellow escorts. I hope you get much good feedback from them.

 

However, I wanted to add at least one client's perspective: if I knew such a client database existed and I suspected an escort participated in populating it, that would be far more than sufficient reason not to hire the escort.

 

I value my privacy and take steps to safeguard it. I do reveal personal details to escorts I hire but only as I get to know them. The longer I know someone, the more they are likely to know about me. But any information that I provide to them is provided with the same kind of expectation of privacy that I would attach to sharing any personal information with anyone.

 

I treat escorts just like I treat any other person in my life, with respect and kindness. In return, I expect to be treated with respect as well. Most certainly, I do not expect to have details of our encounter or personal details about myself posted to some public or quasi-public database (even absent the illegal nature of most escort-client encounters).

 

I understand that some escorts keep records of their meetings with clients. I do not keep records of my meetings with escorts, for a variety of reasons and am not particularly comfortable when an escort reveals that he does keep such written records. Posting information to a database is a step too far and would cause me to immediately cease any and all contact with that escort.

 

Taking it one step further, I would view with great suspicion anyone who participates in an escort website that features a client review database. In fact, the mere existence of an escort's ad on such a database would lead me to conclude that the escort most likely does (or will or might) contribute to that client-review database. Consequently, I'd steer clear of pretty much anyone advertising there.

 

Regards,

BG

[Guest FallenAngel]

Chances are, if you've ever hired an escort for an in-call at your residence, that escort already has enough information about you to contribute to a "client database" or use that information against you, should he ever choose to do so. If an escort comes to your home (apt-condo-house) he's most likely going to know at minimum, your home or cell phone number, address, unit number and potentially last name (on the buzzer) if you're residing in an apt building. With this information alone, he can find more information out about you than you would ever want anyone, esp a stranger to know about you.

 

People expecting total privacy in their lives are fooling themselves if they think that they can safeguard themselves from an information seeking individual if they invite them into their home. Given the simple info mentioned above, within 10 minutes I could have your financial records, criminal records, place of employment etc.

 

Whether we like it or not, we are ALL in many client/customer databases simply based upon transactions we do in our daily lives. An escort-client review database would be no different, except for the fact that it most likely would not meet any criteria that REALLY safeguards your personal information. Then again, safeguarding ones personal information these days by those that have it, is more of a joke than it is a reality.

 

My apologies, I just realized that this is an ask an escort only forum and I am not an escort. Should mgt feel my response is out of place, please feel free to dispose.

[Guest TNT Ted]

BG, I couldn't agree more with your comments.

 

Further, if an escort doesn't have "SOME idea of who is waiting on the other side" of the door, then he probably hasn't done a very good job of up-front communication. I have yet to meet an escort who didn't know at least something about me from the email exchanges we made prior to our meeting.

 

I, also, would steer clear of anyone advertising on such a site.

[Guest ript4hire]

Interesting responses! I had expected people to be a little

uncomfortable with the idea of clients getting reviewed, but I had

no idea that people would outright refuse to hire someone based on

their participation in such a site.

 

Let me clarify what we are talking about here - my friend doesn't

propose posting client's addresses and phone numbers in any public

forum - at all ... ever. But just as there are "no show"

escorts ... there are "no show" clients. Just as there are escorts

who make unreasonable demands ... there are equivolent clients.

Escorts can get an idea of who is "behind the door" of the hotel

room in conversations and email exchanges, I agree ... but there is

more to it than that.

 

I dunno, maybe this idea won't work - and I certainly don't want to

jeapordize any escort's working reputation ... including my own.

Just keep in mind that when you hire an escort, you have seen pics,

you have read profiles, and you have perused reviews. We've just

gotten a phone call or an email ... and are relatively in the dark.

My friend is just trying to see if there is a way to level the

playing field, without compromising anyone's privacy.

 

Eric

[indyeric]

Another client response here:

 

How could escorts possibly identify a client to each other with enough information to accurately identify the client---and acheive the goal of the site--without actually identifying the client to an extent that would make it possible for someone who knows how to do a little detective work to find out the real identity of the client?

 

How do I know that the escort I am contacting is the escort whose reviews I've read? By the email address, the website address, and the phone number. What besides these things would escorts use to identify clients to each other?

 

And how could the site possibly make sure that the client information posted on it would not be used in innappropriate ways by members of the site, including police officers, private detectives, reporters, etc., posing as escorts to join the site and/or pressuring an actual escort to provide information from the site? Or just other escorts soliciting clients?

 

Most clients are looking for the maximum amount of confidentiality and discretion possible. Total security on these issues may be impossible to guarantee. But just as we have to trust other businesses and professionals to safeguard the security of our personal and financial information, we also trust individual escorts and agencies to do the same.

 

When acting out of trust, one knows there is a remote possibility that it might be violated. But we still act out of trust when we think and sense it is likely that trust is warranted. An absence of evidence to the contrary is most definitely a factor in the decision to trust another human being.

 

Knowing an escort participated in some sort of forum in which ANY sort of client-identifying information was posted would automatically rule out that escort for me.

 

And for many clients and potential clients, just knowing such a site existed would very likely cause them to decide that hiring ANY escort was too much of a risk.

 

--Eric

[Guest TNT Ted]

>Just keep in mind that when you hire an escort, you have seen

>pics,

>you have read profiles, and you have perused reviews. We've

>just

>gotten a phone call or an email ... and are relatively in the

>dark.

 

 

Even though we have access to more information about you than you have about us, don't think you're alone in feeling anxiety about what's on the other side of that door. I just figure that you're the professional. Doesn't that come with the job?

[indyeric]

All businesses have risks and dissapointments . . .

 

A quick follow up to my last response. I sympathize with Eric when he writes:

 

"I dunno, maybe this idea won't work - and I certainly don't want to

jeapordize any escort's working reputation ... including my own.

Just keep in mind that when you hire an escort, you have seen pics,

you have read profiles, and you have perused reviews. We've just

gotten a phone call or an email ... and are relatively in the dark.

My friend is just trying to see if there is a way to level the

playing field, without compromising anyone's privacy."

 

As I said, I don't see how you could avoid compromising privacy and have the site you are thinking about be of any use.

 

And bear in mind that you are selling a service. Everyone who succeeds long-term in a career in which he sells anything, be it a service, a product, etc., comes to accept and plan for the fact that there are some customers/clients who will make an appointment and not show up, people who pay their bills late or not on time, people who flake out, etc.

 

And in a service profession such as escort, in which a number of clients are conflicted, worried, paranoid, etc., I would imagine you have to factor into your business model an even greater percentage of no shows, etc., than a lawyer or a piano teacher, etc.

 

In any business, you can't avoid the risks of that business. You include those risks in your business model. When I get frustrated with certain aspects of my profession, I remember, "This is the life we have chosen . . . " Clearly, there are aspects of the escorting profession that suck. And it is the life you have chosen, for now.

 

Clients' PERCEPTION that an escort can be trusted with a certain amount of personal information is very important. I know escorts who take their work very seriously, recognize the important service it is, the value of their work to the client (and indirectly in some cases to the client's family), and regard the trust the client places in them as something sacred.

 

--Eric

[Yeswell]

This is a response to everyone, I guess, and yet another response from a client. My guess would be that most escorts would welcome a site of the sort proposed here but wouldn't want to say so (especially after many of the responses in this thread). I agree that anxiety is part of the job for escorts but that doesn't mean that they shouldn't try to lessen it; I also agree that clients could assume a new identity each time they hire but a site like the one proposed could still circulate a lot of information. When I meet an escort for the first time I often feel uncomfortable about the big difference between what I know about the escort and what he knows about me. I think this site is a very good idea and if I knew an escort was part of it I would be more inclined to hire him because I would take it as indicating that he was serious and professional. And for the record I'm an incredibly clean, punctual, and pleasant client in every way. Ask anyone.

[Lookin]

Eric, another client here.

 

What you’re suggesting is totally fair. But I do think it could cost participating escorts some business, at least in the short term.

 

Being an escort is a pretty public profession. When a guy decides to do it, he knows that his pictures, contact information, and reviews are in the public domain. He may even get a call from Jerry Springer! As a result, there are probably some guys who have chosen not to escort, just for that reason. They don’t want any of their personal information on the internet. Out of a hundred guys who may like the idea of escorting, there may be only fifty who actually decide to do it, and are willing to put themselves out on the web.

 

Being a client, on the other hand, has been a fairly private undertaking. Not that it should be, and not that it’s fair; it just has been. If that changes and, thanks to a new website, being a client suddenly becomes more public than it has been in the past, there will be a subset of today’s clients who will choose not to participate any longer. Just as some potential escorts will opt out of a public forum, so will some potential clients. It’s hard to say how many, but you’ve heard from a few already.

 

Once the new rules are in place, we’ll be left with today’s escorts who are comfortable with public exposure; and a new, probably smaller, set of clients who are also comfortable with public exposure. Of course, that smaller set of clients probably wouldn't include any of the no-shows or other client disasters that you're trying to avoid.

 

As for me, I think my “reviews” would be pretty good, and may even get me to the head of the line. But I would be one of the folks who would not be comfortable with my name, phone number, or email on an escort website. Who knows when our Attorney General will decide he’s got the time to go after a few new vices. So, I would probably stick to a few trusted escorts who don’t participate in the review forum.

 

Except for you, of course! If you ever make it to San Francisco, you can do me, review me, out me, put me in your blog, take me on the Jerry Springer show, drop me off at Alberto Gonzales’ house - whatever! But that’s only for you - and a couple of the other hotties here.

[Steven_Draker]

Personally. I don't think that such a client database is a good thing (as originally presented). I adhere to the saying "Do not do to others what you do not want done to yourself". If I were a client I wouldn't like my personal information to be there.

 

However, I support the idea that "special" clients and rip offs need to be exposed.

 

As to the question "Who is on the other side of the door" - I think that I'm not really concerned by that, because I screen through email and phone conversation. If I have a bad vibe (that may happen rarely) I just decline the offer.

 

Steven Draker ~

http://www.rentboy.com/location/getrb.asp?rentboy=66637&Location=49

 

P.S. BTW Eric, I still think you're hot and I'm looking forward to meeting you in LA/Palm Springs around Easter. :9

[TJM]

Well said BG...I couldn't agree with you more. I also would never hire an escort who was involved in a client review site. No matter how much care is given to protecting the privacy of clients, privacy is inevitably compromised.

 

I've seen a few threads on this site that alluded to the possibility of a client review site and I've always questioned the real motives for it. The way the posts were written gave off an attitude of childish "get-back" or "it's not fair we're reviewed and they're not" rather than an attitude of assisting the escort in weeding out potentially bad encounters. If what's "on the other side of the door" is a real concern for escorts then I'd suggest taking extra time communicating either through email or phone calls. I think a lot can be sensed by what a person says or writes...it's usually very revealing of the person's character. For example, there are escorts who post on this site who I would never hire not just because of what they wrote, but the way in which it was written or the attitude attached to what was written. I'm sure there are escorts who wouldn't want to deal with some of the clients who post for the same reason. On the other hand, there are escorts I really hope to meet some day based on what they wrote and the underlying attitudes that are attached to what they said.

 

There have been a few times that through my conversations with escorts we decided mutually not to meet because we agreed that we might not be compatible. In fact one time an escort actually pointed me in the direction of another escort who he thought I might be more compatible with...and he was right! In these conversations there were no bad feelings or negative vibes...just an honest exchange of information, thoughts and feelings. I think this is partially the kind of respect BG is talking about. This is a much more adult and mature way of dealing with the issue at hand rather than creating a website that very well may violate client privacy and may be used as a childish game of "get back".

 

Personally I would view any escort who participated in such a site as unprofessional and not trustworthy. The good news is that there are, as the old addage goes, many fish in the sea and I know there are excellent escorts who are professional and mature enough to steer clear of such misguided and myopic business practices.

[+ deej]

>Let me clarify what we are talking about here - my friend doesn't

>propose posting client's addresses and phone numbers in any public

>forum - at all ... ever.

 

But there's the rub. Allowing information to be posted, even in a private place, WILL make the information public eventually.

 

Someone WILL go off the deep end and decide to copy/paste it to a public place. It's not a "might happen" scenario. It WILL happen. The words that YOU write "in private" will eventually be made public.

 

It's an absolute given.

 

There used to be an escorts-only forum on this very message center. (It's actually still there, but nobody has access to it.) Hooboy restricted access to only those escorts he "knew" and trusted. The trust was betrayed, repeatedly, by people who were highly trusted, so the forum was shut down.

 

Anything ever posted to the internet, even on a private forum/database, will eventually be made public somehow.

[Guest Jesse Dane]

Bad idea. I think any escort who would participate in something like this would lose a large amount of credibility when it comes to being discrete.

 

The only thing of this type that is acceptable I think is a "Bad Client" list. I have heard of a few of those that are used strictly for situations where a client did something such as rough up an escort, completely refuse to pay, or something extreme along those lines. Unless they do something very wrong, there is no need to tell anyone else anything about them.

[Guest ript4hire]

Ok, I will chime in one last time for some clarification, and then I

will let it go.

 

Firstly, I think there IS a way to do this AND maintain client

privacy. We would not be modeling our reviews on Hooboy’s set up.

Nowhere, in public OR private, would there be a browsable list of

clients with their contact information. In fact, the listings would

not be browsable at all. It would be a search function. Let’s say

a new client calls the escort. The escort goes to the site and

plugs in the phone number – the name “Mr. X” comes up with 3 short

reviews. These reviews would NOT be performance based, but solely

notes on general behavior (ie. “Good guy, lots of fun” or “Heavily

into drugs, make sure you ask about it”) – just things that let the

escort know the general vibe. In the resulting record, there would

be NO contact information … and if the escort didn’t already HAVE

the client’s email or phone number, they would never be able to

REACH the record.

 

Secondly, I have to say that I am a little disappointed in some of

the client reactions on here. This is a place where you come to do

research so you have a safe and pleasurable escort experience.

These suggestions that all an escort needs to do to feel safe and

comfortable is “spend some time on the phone” … well that is a two

way street. All a client would need is to spend some time on the

phone – but instead we have this great site with all its

information. Which, for the record, I think is a great thing. It

has nothing to do with clients “getting back” at escorts … just as

this idea has nothing to do with escorts “getting back” at clients.

 

And last, the implication that an escort who might try and do

something to lessen the risk (I agree that risk is part of the biz

and can’t be avoided) would be considered “unprofessional and not

trustworthy” … well, I don’t really know what to say to that.

Except that it seems hypocritical coming from someone using this

site. Businesses run credit checks on customers so the businesses

don’t get burned – I don’t see anyone labeling that a “misguided and

myopic business practice.”

 

Ah well, for the over-reactors here the good news is that it will

probably never happen. Neither I, nor my friend, would want to cost

any escort work – I guess that has to be the bottom line.

 

And for the record, I have never given away ANY client information.

Don’t want to be labeled as a big mouth just for bringing up this

idea!

 

Eric

[Guest ript4hire]

Hey Lookin - thanks for the well thought out and reasonable

response. Shoot me an email so I can put you on my "to do" list for

San Francisco!

 

Eric

[Guest TNT Ted]

>Ah well, for the over-reactors here the good news is that it

>will

>probably never happen.

 

 

Over-reactors?? Seems to me you asked for some thoughts. You got them. Who was over-reacting?

[indyeric]

Eric wrote:

[blockquote]Firstly, I think there IS a way to do this AND maintain client

privacy. We would not be modeling our reviews on Hooboy’s set up.

Nowhere, in public OR private, would there be a browsable list of

clients with their contact information. In fact, the listings would

not be browsable at all. It would be a search function. Let’s say

a new client calls the escort. The escort goes to the site and

plugs in the phone number – the name “Mr. X” comes up with 3 short

reviews. These reviews would NOT be performance based, but solely

notes on general behavior (ie. “Good guy, lots of fun” or “Heavily

into drugs, make sure you ask about it”) – just things that let the

escort know the general vibe. In the resulting record, there would

be NO contact information … and if the escort didn’t already HAVE

the client’s email or phone number, they would never be able to

REACH the record.[/blockquote][p]As I said, I understand your desire. But what you have described is a database of phone numbers which, while not browseable, could very potentially be hacked into. Just as credit card lists occasionally get disclosed, there's the risk with that in what you are envisioning. The entire thing would also be subject to subpeona or seizure by police--as happens to the records of agenices on occasion, etc. And this list of phone numbers and reviews is a record of what would be presumed to be illegal activity (despite all the "time only" disclaimers put on websites, which I don't believe have ever held up in court, have they?).[p]Now you're right, Eric, that all sorts of businesses run credit checks on customers--but they can do so only with the explicit permission of the customer. When I apply for a credit card, for example, I have to give permission for my credit to be checked and also for the credit card company to submit information on my dealings with them to the credit agencies.[p]To parallel this you could, I suppose, set up some sort of voluntary system by which clients explicitly agree to be part of a database and you could ask clients for permission to check their phone number in it. I doubt, though, that would go over well.[p]There are all sorts of businesses and professional services that are reviewed in newspapers and websites, etc., that do not create a database of their customers to share with each other. I wouldn't be very enthusiastic about making a reservation at a restaurant where I knew they'd put my name or number into a search engine to see if I was a good tipper, had ever been rude , had not shown up for a reservation, etc.[p]Well, all this has been a client response. Now I'll "ask an escort." How much of a problem are the type of clients Eric wants to know about?

[Funseeker 22]

Hi Eric,

Welcome Back from far far away !!!. If you`re back yet ?.

Like Steven & Jesse I too think bad idea. Shit happens (hopefully not)to cause a last minute change of plan but no one needs to be blacklisted.It happens both ways.

I have never been a no show at any prearranged meeting except with at least 24 hours notice. I remember seeing a well known Brazilian Visitor on his first US visit who was mortified at his last minute cancellation rate.

You and I have met before but kept our real identities very quiet. ;-) ;-) :-). That`s the way it should be unless you/we choose otherwise.

[Juan Vancouver]

... and thoroughly delicious!

 

SLUUURP!

[+ newatthis]

>This is a place where you come to do research so you have a safe and pleasurable escort experience.

>

>These suggestions that all an escort needs to do to feel safe and comfortable is “spend some time on the phone” … well that is a

>two way street. All a client would need is to spend some time on the phone – but instead we have this great site with all its information.

 

Eric -- I think you misunderstand how many of us use this site. It doesn't replace personal contact with the escort we're considering -- it's a place to browse for guys who might be right for us, based on their pictures, profiles, and what others have written of them.

 

But that's only the initial step. The most important step is what follows: making contact, observing how prompt a guy is in responding and whether the interchange has the elements that are important to us (for me these include professionalism, playfulness, and a host of others), and finally, if those contacts have been by email, having a "real" conversation by phone.

 

-new

 

PS (not strictly germane to what you posted above) As someone else wrote, an escort's voice here on the message center can have a huge effect on whether I'm interested in hiring him. There are several guys who've made it to my "definitely interested" list solely for that reason. In some of these cases I've initiated email contact, confirmed that my impression was correct, and encouraged the guy in question to visit my town and let me know when he makes plans to do so.

[JT Brooklyn]

Eric.. Who even though not Constantly running his AD..is Definitely one of the most Popular, IF not right now, The Most Popular of the "Traveler's"...

 

BUT being actually a "New" Working Guy to this site, still I'm sure has "Great Respect" for the Privacy of everyone he meets. He also expects it in return.

 

I'm sure he now, has had his Original Question Answered to everyone's satisfaction. :P

[Epigonos]

Eric just one more comment from a client -- I know just what you want and need. In my second email contact with all escorts I am considering hiring I ALWAYS state that I think it unfair that I, the client, know so much more about him than he know about me. I then give him a detailed physical description of myself including my age, my height, my weight and the fact that my head is shaved. I also describe my sexual likes and dislikes. I then conclude by stating that if the above information is acceptable he should let me know and we can then proceed making arrangements to meet.

I have NO difficulty providing that information, PRIVATELY, to the escort, HOWEVER, I would NOT want that information appearing in ANY public or semipublic forum. If I even suspected that the escort, I was considering hiring, might post that information I would NEVER hire him.

[Guest bernardff]

The Irony:!

A man like yourself who can't seem to get enough 'worldwide' 'discretion' opens THIS can of worms!

Neverthless as someone who doesnt give a fuck about the 'straight' world ,i'd like to explore the idea of a review site for johns.Like a good ####,a good john should welcome feedback and a chance to do a better 'job'.

good Luck Eric

and for christs sake,Fuck Me.XXXX

[rickyricardo]

>Fellow Workin' Boys,

>

>I am in talks with a web programmer friend of mine to put

>together a

>new escort website. It will have similar functionality to

>RentBoy

>and the others, but one of the new features will be a

>client

>review database.

>

>He wanted me to get some opinions - to see if you think that

>something like this would be useful, and if you would

>contribute to

>it, etc. He is going over ways to keep ALL client contact

>info

>confidential ... so no one's privacy would be violated. We

>just

>want to give escorts a tool so when they show up at that hotel

>room

>door ... they have SOME idea of who is waiting on the other

>side!

>

>Thoughts?

>

>Eric

 

 

I am sorry , I would not participate in something like this. what would be the purpose of reviewing a client. That it totally in violation of my privacy clause on my website. So I could not , and will not contribute to something like this. Now with the female escort they have a client database but its call the "DO NOT SEE LIST" this is a database where female escorts can access to see if a client they booking is on , based on NO SHOWS, DISRESPECTFUL,DIFFULCULT , DRUG ABUSE ETC.. this is done as a security measure for the female escorts. I can understand that.. But this thing about giving information about client just to know what your expecting. If you communicate well with your client you will know what to expect when going to see them.

 

 

Ricardo Milos

http://www.RicardoMilos.net

http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/26/26_21_5.gif http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/26/26_21_5.gif http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/26/26_21_5.gif http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/26/26_21_5.gif http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/26/26_21_5.gif http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/26/26_21_5.gif http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/26/26_21_5.gif http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/26/26_21_5.gif http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/26/26_21_5.gif http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/26/26_21_5.gif