HooBoy, Community, BN, and the End of Shame

[Guest nycjockguy]

Greetings from a longtime lurker who has followed the conversation here with great fascination since the death of HooBoy.

 

And what I wish to offer in my first post is an insight into the power of this site and its far-reaching repercussions for escorts and their clients alike.

 

For what HooBoy created, and what Daddy and the moderators have nurtured, is nothing less than the revolutionary notion of a community of escorts and clients. With the creation of that community has come the understanding that being an escort or a client is not at all a shameful thing, despite what the larger society tells us.

 

Which is why I find elements of the BN discourse so profoundly distressing and retrograde. Comments such as "after all, he's just a prostitute" or "he gets paid to lick and caress the bodies of overweight old men" (I am paraphrasing here) come from a place of shame, I would argue. What's more, intentionally or not, such comments demean and dehumanize virtually the entire membership of this community: the escorts/sex workers and their clients.

 

What I'm saying, I guess, is I'm all for open debate and discussion, and I certainly wouldn't want to censor anybody's opinion. But I do think that our founder and its current leaders have created a very special place here, and it that is fully appropriate to censure those who would take us back to that shameful place of "prostitutes" and "johns" before this site existed.

 

With great gratitude to HooBoy, Daddy, the moderators, and to all the escorts/sex workers whose glowing reviews show them to be far more than "prostitutes," as well as their reviewers.

 

Best,

 

nycjockguy

[joel304]

Wiping tears ;(

[Guest ChgoBoy]

With all the controversy that is generated, discussesd and bantered around in here, it's interesting that you pick BN to highlight your first post. I suspect this new poster is BN.

[bigguyinpasadena]

What fools you are Joel and ChgoBoy -BN has plenty of people here who like him and his post-and to think that he would shill for himself is just laughable.

God this place is becoming a haven for bitter old jealous queens-very tiresome.

[Steven_Draker]

Welcome to the board, nycjockguy !

[Steven_Draker]

>I suspect this new poster is BN.

 

ChgoBoy, he's not BN. I guarantee that.

 

Steven Draker ~

[Guest nycjockguy]

LOL. Monsieur Draker's guarantee is based upon the fact that I employed his services -- quite satisfyingly, I might add -- in Brussels last week. And, should you need further proof that I am not BN, here it is: I won't tell you what (fabulous) hotel and restaurants I stayed at, or even what class I flew home in.

[Guest skrubber]

I for one am sick and tired of the Ben bashing. I have never met a kinder more considerate classy young man in my entire life and those of you who besmirk him (who have never even met him) should be ashamed of yourselves.

[DelawareGuy]

I'd like to thank nycjock for posting that message. Having been a member of this community for a couple of years now, my awareness has been raised regarding escort/client relationships. I am neither ashamed or embarassed by hiring young gentlemen for companionship (the part about fucking my brains out is purely coincidental and is a spontaneous act between two consenting adults). I have met escorts of sterling character that I wouldn't hesitate to take home to meet Mom (although I think that wouldn't be the best way to optimize my time with him). Having this board to communicate is a wonderful thing, certainly for clients and I'm sure for escorts as well. I've learned a lot, grown a lot, made new friends. May it last forever!

[Guest ChgoBoy]

>What fools you are Joel and ChgoBoy -BN has plenty of

>people here who like him and his post-and to think that he

>would shill for himself is just laughable.

 

Hey Big Guy, why is it laughable to think that he would shill for himself? The fact is, Benjamin Nicholas does not exist. He is a made up persona like Darth Vader, Indiana Jones or Austin Powers. He is made up for entertainment purposes and the character/actor has a website and blog to keep people up to date on his hi-jinx. The person behind Benjamin Nicholas is shilling for him everytime he takes pen to hand. Why is it unreasonable to think that an actor would want to protect his character, esp, when of late, that character has been in the light he has been?

The reason I made the post, was because I just found the posting curious, for a first time poster. My God, most people here question the validity of first time reviewers on the other side and dont get hacked up, why should I be any different on this side? I agree, the BN topic is tired, but in no way do my thoughts reflect someone who is old and bitter. I am neither.

Btw...good luck in Vegas. The only advice I can give is; never hit on 17 and never hit on someone 17.....

[JT Brooklyn]

Hopefully we can all go on now, with New Topics, New Faces and Definitely New Ideas on how to enjoy our Sex Lives..While we still have them .LOL :+

[Txpaytoplay]

Chgboy writes

 

I agree, the BN topic is tired, but in

>no way do my thoughts reflect someone who is old and bitter. I

>am neither.

 

I don't know about the age part but your statements on this board definately contradict your recent statement above!!!!:o

[Guest ChgoBoy]

>Chgboy writes

>

> I agree, the BN topic is tired, but in

>>no way do my thoughts reflect someone who is old and bitter.

>I

>>am neither.

>

>I don't know about the age part but your statements on this

>board definately contradict your recent statement above!!!!:o

>

 

Whatever.

[taylorky]

take us back to

>that shameful place of "prostitutes" and "johns" before this

>site existed.

>

 

odd, anyone ashamed of the words "prostitutes" and "johns",has a real problem if they continue to hire "prostitutes" and be "johns".

 

sounds like ye harbor a boatload of guilt...

[taylorky]

ummmmm i have a novel idea.........stop reading it,jeeessshhhhh.

[Guest Delaware Man]

>Hopefully we can all go on now, with New Topics, New Faces

>and Definitely New Ideas on how to enjoy our Sex Lives..While

>we still have them .LOL :+

Amen.

[carryover123]

Thanks for starting this post. I was trying to convey the same idea with my post on "A late post but..." You got the point across more directly. I completely agree with the premis of this post, appreciate the site, and the help others have given me in this cyber-community.

 

Also, I am tired of the BN bashing. I have found him to be considerate, kind, and sharing when I was with him. I would highly recommend him and feel he is a great guy IMHO.

 

If you look at his blog he stated he paid for wine and was drinking from a plastic cup. That does not sound like first class to me. I am glad to hear about the places he visits. I would rather hear a review of a nice restaruant than a review of the Grand Slam at Denny's (that is a breakfast at a restaruant not bedroom activities), or the view of the highway from the Motel 6.

 

He gives me ideas on places I may never go to or may want to consider going to. I find his blogs interesting and enjoy them and IMHO he is trying to make them interesting and entertaining. I do not take his comments to be a type of - look at what I can do. When I was with him he thanked me for taking him to a show and dinners and seemed to appreciate the activities we shared.

 

I did not post on the other threads as I was hoping the BN bashing would stop. I really do not want to start up the BN bashing but just wanted to offer my view.

[Guest ChgoBoy]

so far, there is no BN bashing on this thread. Just an exchange of thought.

[woodlawn]

>Which is why I find elements of the BN discourse so profoundly

>distressing and retrograde. Comments such as "after all, he's

>just a prostitute" or "he gets paid to lick and caress the

>bodies of overweight old men" (I am paraphrasing here) come

>from a place of shame, I would argue. What's more,

>intentionally or not, such comments demean and dehumanize

>virtually the entire membership of this community: the

>escorts/sex workers and their clients.

 

Such comments only "demean and dehumanize" escorts and clients if you happen to think that being a prostitute or getting paid to lick and caress the bodies of overweight old men is demeaning or dehumanizing.

 

The "lick and caress" phrase comes from a post of Doug69. One of Doug's favorite rhetorical devices is to describe something in stark, unadorned but accurate terms that other posters prefer to describe only with polite euphemisms. It's not uncommon for others to react negatively when he does this, and that reaction proves the point he's usually trying to make with this device: there are a lot of posters here who dress up what clients and escorts do with flowery words because they still feel uncomfortable about the truth of the matter. Escorts, at least the ones reviewed on this site, ARE prostitutes. They DO get paid to "lick and caress the bodies of overweight old men." If you don't have a problem with that, why would you have a problem when Doug describes it?

[trilingual]

You clearly missed the entire point of the original posting. The poster isn't challenging the truth of Doug69's statement. The poster is saying that our choice of words in expressing ourselves reveals a great deal about our thought processes.

 

Most of us here don't believe that prostitution or hiring prostitutes is "bad." But the word "prostitute" has pejorative connotations (just as the ridiculously auto-censored "w-word" has), particularly in countries like the U.S. where it's an illegal activity. "Escort" is much less pejorative.

 

Choosing to use the words with the most negative connotations to describe one's M4M activities does reveal shame, self-loathing, etc., just as choosing to refer to oneself constantly as a "faggot" or "fag," instead of "gay," reveals similar shame or self-loathing about one's sexual orientation. THAT's the point of the original posting.

[woodlawn]

>You clearly missed the entire point of the original posting.

>The poster isn't challenging the truth of Doug69's statement.

>The poster is saying that our choice of words in expressing

>ourselves reveals a great deal about our thought processes.

 

On the contrary, it's you who are missing the point. You're right in saying that our choice of words reveals our thought processes. And that's exactly what Doug is saying when he uses that particular rhetorical device. He's saying that posters who insist on sugar-coating prostitution with a word like "escort," which doesn't accurately describe what the person referred to actually does in return for the money he gets, are revealing that they're uncomfortable with what they are doing -- paying or getting paid for sex.

[Guest nycjockguy]

For the record, I find the characterization of clients as "fat old men" even more demeaning and dehumanizing (and probably inaccurate, but who knows for sure -- I can only speak for myself) than I do the term "prostitute."

 

SOME escort/sex workers are indeed "just prostitutes," and SOME clients are certainly fat and old.

 

but my hunch is that the escort/sex workers who get raves here are much more than that, some even probably descend from the courtesans of yore. (some of whom were even invested with sacred powers!! but let's not go there.....)

[woodlawn]

>but my hunch is that the escort/sex workers who get raves here

>are much more than that, some even probably descend from the

>courtesans of yore.

 

How interesting. But whatever they are, it isn't very accurate to refer to them as "escorts," since they're rarely if ever hired to "escort" anyone anywhere. They're hired for sex. As you know.

 

That's the thing about euphemisms. They're designed to obfuscate, not to communicate.

[Guest Tampa Yankee]

>How interesting. But whatever they are, it isn't very

>accurate to refer to them as "escorts," since they're rarely

>if ever hired to "escort" anyone anywhere. They're hired for

>sex. As you know.

 

I really don't think it rare that guys are hired as escorts. I definitely have on many occasions and I know of other clients that do as well. Certainly many hires, maybe most, are short-term sex-intensive encounters. But many are hired for extended engagements be it several hours, overnights, weekends or travel. I don't know any 'fat old men' that can stand the trauma of only intensive sex over such periods. :o For those that have that stamina, God Bless them -- as he seems to have done.

 

For me and I know for other clients the choice of a companion over an extended engagement depends on much more than their physical desirablity or sexual capacity. Their ability to be a true companion out of the bedroom as well as in bed is a key factor. No matter how great the sex might be it cannot counter over an extended interval a deficient personality, poor manners, limited intellect, disengaged attitude, etc. LIfe is too short and money to valuable to waste either.

[woodlawn]

>>How interesting. But whatever they are, it isn't very

>>accurate to refer to them as "escorts," since they're rarely

>>if ever hired to "escort" anyone anywhere. They're hired

>for

>>sex. As you know.

 

>I really don't think it rare that guys are hired as escorts.

 

I really do think it is rare. And so would anyone reading the reviews posted on this site. Few reviewers talk about hiring someone to "escort" them someplace. And even those who do make it clear that the whole point of the engagement is that a time comes when they are alone and have sexual contact. How many of these reviewers do you think would hire an "escort" if it was made absolutely clear beforehand that there would be NO sexual contact of ANY kind? "None" would be my estimate. How many "escorts" out there believe that you could make a living by providing clients with NOTHING other than "companionship"?