Asking escort for HIV Oraquick test

[+ Chris Eisenhower]

There are posters in DC around a number of drugstores that discuss the percentage of people who either don't know or are not on treatment. When I first saw the statistic I was surprised, especially since the free clinic in pretty much every city in which I've lived has always been busy, busy, busy at any given time. But no one is getting tested—they are always there for other issues. There are organizations around DC that give free testing for both HIV and the spectrum of common STIs. There is never a line. I don't get it.

 

Regarding ELISA, there was a study I considered joining at a major university that was testing possible vaccines for HIV. One of the drawbacks of the study was that you would test positive for an antibody reaction to HIV from that point on, which I was not willing to do.

[+ Chris Eisenhower]

There are so many statistics out there it can make someone dizzy. Personally, I never cared for or followed statistics, only what I felt was the right decision for myself. I go in with the mentality that if its risky, its risky, whether its 10% at risk or 60% at risk.

 

Don't get me wrong, I agree with you in that it's really just a guess that they're making about infection rates and so on. I was just surprised that the number seems so high given the length of time that HIV has been in the public consciousness. And while people—especially young people—are accused of being much more cavalier and even fatalistic about contracting HIV and the supposed ease of managing it with a pill or two, I would have thought many more people would be getting themselves tested with regularity.

[Juan Vancouver]

I really want to hire and have some good time but hiv really concerns me even with protection.

Has anyone actually asked their potential hire for hiv oraquick test at the start of the appointment? What was the escort reaction to this request?

 

I am going to address this little by little. There's so much to this question!

 

Personally, I wouldn't mind in the least bit if anyone asked me to do an oral test. I would not under any circumstance undergo a blood based test from a someone who is not a health professional in an adequate environment, but an oral test, please, knock your socks off.

 

However, by the mere act of asking me to do this, I would know immediately that you know absolutely nothing about HIV and the way it spreads.

 

By having sex only with men who test negative on an oral test, you are agreeing to have sex with two groups of people: the ones that are currently negative, and the ones that have recently seroconverted. There are two moments in which viral loads are at the max, when the patient is experiencing full blown AIDS but also right after seroconversion. This means that if your partner seroconverted two and a half months before meeting you and he doesn't know it, chances are the test will come back negative but the concentration of HIV virus will be so high in all his fluids that contagion is much more likely.

 

You would be all relaxed thinking you did the responsible thing, but you would be having sex with someone at the height of contagiousness.

 

Not clever, if you are wanting to minimize risks.

 

But that is not the real issue here. You say that HIV concerns you even when using appropriate protection. It concerns you so much that you are willing to make a really bad decision (using an oral test as safeguard) just to appease your fear.

 

I would like to suggest that your problem is not HIV. Your problem is a very common problem that many men of a certain generation suffer and a problem that very few people talk about, I am talking about Post Traumatic Stress Disorder. Your emotional reaction to HIV and the losses you experienced or perceived around you have rendered your logic useless. You are ignoring the science, you are ignoring common sense and you are reacting to an over inflated fear based on past trauma.

 

Logic and science tells us that if we perform safer sex every time and treat every partner as if he is positive, if we educate ourselves carefully, not reading the fear mongering "studies" but the cold fact science, if we test often enough, if we recognize that every act carries a risk but if we learn to negotiate what risks we are comfortable with and what others we are not, then we will have a certain degree of safety and we will be able to calculate our risks objectively.

 

Over inflated fear that comes from past trauma tells us that no matter what we do we are at high risk, and our decision making process will be muddled. Fear will force us to make choices that will appease the fear, but will not minimize the risk, because when we are on survival mode facts don't count. The only thing that counts is fear. That's how an oral test makes us feel great, even if by using one we end up having sex with highly infectious people who don't know they are infected.

 

The problem here, again, is not having sex with highly infectious people. If you practice safer sex, you'll be fine. The problem is the lack of logic of your process, which is taking you in the opposite direction you want to go.

 

I would sincerely recommend you to talk to a professional. Even if post traumatic stress disorder might feel right, and logical, (It is just trying to keep us safe!) I assure you that a good mental health professional can help you alleviate it making your life a much more enjoyable place. Sex doesn't have to be a mine field, you don't have to live in terror. You lived through horrible times that most of us are entirely unable to imagine, but thankfully for now HIV doesn't carry the death sentence it once did. We know how it works, We know how it is prevented, there are medicines that make it manageable and there are medicines that make it really fucking hard to contract. Your terror is no longer justified. I am not trying to minimize your emotions, emotions are real whether they are based in real event or not, I am just telling you that level of worry is not only not necessary now, it's also possibly damaging you.

 

And speaking of mental health... How are you planning to deal with the men who test positive in front of you and didn't know they were positive? (Statistically it is bound to happen. Some of the men who "know" they are negative, WILL test positive with you.) Are you prepared to help them ease into it in a healthy way? Do you have any training for this kind of situation? Are you qualified to give the support and care they WILL need or are you just planning to say "Oh, you're positive, here's your 250, now go."?

 

I am not slamming you. I am genuinely concerned that you might be getting in situations you don't want to experience.

 

You are not the only man suffering from this fear. There are support groups, there's individual therapy, there are options. You deserve to live a full, exciting, relaxed, healthy life.

[+ WmClarke]

Very insightful--as usual, Juan.

[Steven_Draker]

Again, there's nothing wrong with asking, eridrin.

 

If someone refuses the test, he probably has something to hide.

 

Keep searching until you find the right escort for you. Accept only what is comfortable for YOU.

[+ quoththeraven]

Juan -- As usual, you hit the nail right on the head.

 

If you take precautions, your partner's status doesn't matter. I endorse what Juan said regarding how to deal with the anxiety about seroconverting despite taking reasonable precautions. I didn't realize this anxiety existed until I read stories about people who use PrEP plus condoms for that very reason.

[Steven_Draker]

your partner's status doesn't matter

 

It may not matter to you, but it matters to others.

[+ quoththeraven]

It may not matter to you, but it matters to others.

 

What I mean -- and you've said the same thing yourself -- is that proper precautions (such as the use of condoms) mitigates risk to the point where one's partner's status is irrelevant from a public health standpoint. (As in making it possible to have sex with men who are HIV positive and not worry that the virus will be transmitted.) If that weren't the case, then assuming everyone is HIV+ and using condoms isn't a sufficient answer.

 

As Juan points out, there's also the emotional aspect of it. But at that rate presumably the purpose of the test is to serosort. One can't be 100% sure of the other person's status anyway, given the existence of a window period in any test. If that's what's necessary to make someone feel more comfortable, that's their prerogative, but it also helps perpetuate the myth that "knowledge" of the other person's status provides extra protection.

[Juan Vancouver]

As Juan points out, there's also the emotional aspect of it. But at that rate presumably the purpose of the test is to serosort. One can't be 100% sure of the other person's status anyway, given the existence of a window period in any test. If that's what's necessary to make someone feel more comfortable, that's their prerogative, but it also helps perpetuate the myth that "knowledge" of the other person's status provides extra protection.

 

One day I will learn to write as succinctly as you do.

 

Yes, serosorting is only possible if you have a facility with cages where you can keep men in seclusion for as long as your preferred test's window period happens to be.

 

Test your men, throw them in the cage, wait for the window period, test again. Fuck each other's brains out.

 

Doable, yes. Probably it is not entirely legal, though. Turns out humans kind of like being free.

 

Serosorting is a comforting idea, but it's not a real solution. Especially when it comes to casual encounters. Serosorting was suggested as an alternative in the frame of a strictly monogamous relationship. If you are fucking with people who fuck other people, you have to educate yourself about the true risks and about the only way to protect yourself: having safer sex every single time. If you want to supplement with PREP, then go for it. Anything else is comparable to magic potions to protect you from bad spirits. Comforting. But useless.

 

Of course everyone is entitled to want a talisman against bad vibes. Everyone's entitled to ask their partners to undergo an oral test.

 

It's your life, it's your money, it's your time.

[Rudynate]

I am going to address this little by little. There's so much to this question!

 

Personally, I wouldn't mind in the least bit if anyone asked me to do an oral test. I would not under any circumstance undergo a blood based test from a someone who is not a health professional in an adequate environment, but an oral test, please, knock your socks off.

 

However, by the mere act of asking me to do this, I would know immediately that you know absolutely nothing about HIV and the way it spreads.

 

By having sex only with men who test negative on an oral test, you are agreeing to have sex with two groups of people: the ones that are currently negative, and the ones that have recently seroconverted. There are two moments in which viral loads are at the max, when the patient is experiencing full blown AIDS but also right after seroconversion. This means that if your partner seroconverted two and a half months before meeting you and he doesn't know it, chances are the test will come back negative but the concentration of HIV virus will be so high in all his fluids that contagion is much more likely.

 

You would be all relaxed thinking you did the responsible thing, but you would be having sex with someone at the height of contagiousness.

 

Not clever, if you are wanting to minimize risks.

 

But that is not the real issue here. You say that HIV concerns you even when using appropriate protection. It concerns you so much that you are willing to make a really bad decision (using an oral test as safeguard) just to appease your fear.

 

I would like to suggest that your problem is not HIV. Your problem is a very common problem that many men of a certain generation suffer and a problem that very few people talk about, I am talking about Post Traumatic Stress Disorder. Your emotional reaction to HIV and the losses you experienced or perceived around you have rendered your logic useless. You are ignoring the science, you are ignoring common sense and you are reacting to an over inflated fear based on past trauma.

 

Logic and science tells us that if we perform safer sex every time and treat every partner as if he is positive, if we educate ourselves carefully, not reading the fear mongering "studies" but the cold fact science, if we test often enough, if we recognize that every act carries a risk but if we learn to negotiate what risks we are comfortable with and what others we are not, then we will have a certain degree of safety and we will be able to calculate our risks objectively.

 

Over inflated fear that comes from past trauma tells us that no matter what we do we are at high risk, and our decision making process will be muddled. Fear will force us to make choices that will appease the fear, but will not minimize the risk, because when we are on survival mode facts don't count. The only thing that counts is fear. That's how an oral test makes us feel great, even if by using one we end up having sex with highly infectious people who don't know they are infected.

 

The problem here, again, is not having sex with highly infectious people. If you practice safer sex, you'll be fine. The problem is the lack of logic of your process, which is taking you in the opposite direction you want to go.

 

I would sincerely recommend you to talk to a professional. Even if post traumatic stress disorder might feel right, and logical, (It is just trying to keep us safe!) I assure you that a good mental health professional can help you alleviate it making your life a much more enjoyable place. Sex doesn't have to be a mine field, you don't have to live in terror. You lived through horrible times that most of us are entirely unable to imagine, but thankfully for now HIV doesn't carry the death sentence it once did. We know how it works, We know how it is prevented, there are medicines that make it manageable and there are medicines that make it really fucking hard to contract. Your terror is no longer justified. I am not trying to minimize your emotions, emotions are real whether they are based in real event or not, I am just telling you that level of worry is not only not necessary now, it's also possibly damaging you.

 

And speaking of mental health... How are you planning to deal with the men who test positive in front of you and didn't know they were positive? (Statistically it is bound to happen. Some of the men who "know" they are negative, WILL test positive with you.) Are you prepared to help them ease into it in a healthy way? Do you have any training for this kind of situation? Are you qualified to give the support and care they WILL need or are you just planning to say "Oh, you're positive, here's your 250, now go."?

 

I am not slamming you. I am genuinely concerned that you might be getting in situations you don't want to experience.

 

You are not the only man suffering from this fear. There are support groups, there's individual therapy, there are options. You deserve to live a full, exciting, relaxed, healthy life.

 

Your logic and sensitivity are unmatched. I think I'm in love.

[+ WmClarke]

Your logic and sensitivity are unmatched. I think I'm in love.

 

"Think"? I KNOW I am.

[SteveEscort]

 

If someone refuses the test, he probably has something to hide

 

Juan answers the questioner perfectly. You just act stupid as usual Steven. I would refuse it !!!!!!! Why.... Because it's a stupid test in the context it's being taken in, it doesn't tell you anything about the persons sexual health at the moment it's taken and because it's an invasion of privacy. I have nothing to hide.

 

I correct myself, I wouldn't refuse the test, I would refuse the appointment to take the test. I don't need that sort of drama in my life

 

I wish you would just grow up

 

As the self proclaimed stats and facts man around here, you're lacking in your own common sense. Behave please. You're making other gay escorts look stupid. Imagine if clients thought we were all like you.

[SteveEscort]

I am going to address this little by little. There's so much to this question!

 

Personally, I wouldn't mind in the least bit if anyone asked me to do an oral test. I would not under any circumstance undergo a blood based test from a someone who is not a health professional in an adequate environment, but an oral test, please, knock your socks off.

 

However, by the mere act of asking me to do this, I would know immediately that you know absolutely nothing about HIV and the way it spreads.

 

By having sex only with men who test lnegative on an oral test, you are agreeing to have sex with two groups of people: the ones that are currently negative, and the ones that have recently seroconverted. There are two moments in which viral loads are at the max, when the patient is experiencing full blown AIDS but also right after seroconversion. This means that if your partner seroconverted two and a half months before meeting you and he doesn't know it, chances are the test will come back negative but the concentration of HIV virus will be so high in all his fluids that contagion is much more likely.

 

You would be all relaxed thinking you did the responsible thing, but you would be having sex with someone at the height of contagiousness.

 

Not clever, if you are wanting to minimize risks.

 

But that is not the real issue here. You say that HIV concerns you even when using appropriate protection. It concerns you so much that you are willing to make a really bad decision (using an oral test as safeguard) just to appease your fear.

 

I would like to suggest that your problem is not HIV. Your problem is a very common problem that many men of a certain generation suffer and a problem that very few people talk about, I am talking about Post Traumatic Stress Disorder. Your emotional reaction to HIV and the losses you experienced or perceived around you have rendered your logic useless. You are ignoring the science, you are ignoring common sense and you are reacting to an over inflated fear based on past trauma.

 

Logic and science tells us that if we perform safer sex every time and treat every partner as if he is positive, if we educate ourselves carefully, not reading the fear mongering "studies" but the cold fact science, if we test often enough, if we recognize that every act carries a risk but if we learn to negotiate what risks we are comfortable with and what others we are not, then we will have a certain degree of safety and we will be able to calculate our risks objectively.

 

Over inflated fear that comes from past trauma tells us that no matter what we do we are at high risk, and our decision making process will be muddled. Fear will force us to make choices that will appease the fear, but will not minimize the risk, because when we are on survival mode facts don't count. The only thing that counts is fear. That's how an oral test makes us feel great, even if by using one we end up having sex with highly infectious people who don't know they are infected.

 

The problem here, again, is not having sex with highly infectious people. If you practice safer sex, you'll be fine. The problem is the lack of logic of your process, which is taking you in the opposite direction you want to go.

 

I would sincerely recommend you to talk to a professional. Even if post traumatic stress disorder might feel right, and logical, (It is just trying to keep us safe!) I assure you that a good mental health professional can help you alleviate it making your life a much more enjoyable place. Sex doesn't have to be a mine field, you don't have to live in terror. You lived through horrible times that most of us are entirely unable to imagine, but thankfully for now HIV doesn't carry the death sentence it once did. We know how it works, We know how it is prevented, there are medicines that make it manageable and there are medicines that make it really fucking hard to contract. Your terror is no longer justified. I am not trying to minimize your emotions, emotions are real whether they are based in real event or not, I am just telling you that level of worry is not only not necessary now, it's also possibly damaging you.

 

And speaking of mental health... How are you planning to deal with the men who test positive in front of you and didn't know they were positive? (Statistically it is bound to happen. Some of the men who "know" they are negative, WILL test positive with you.) Are you prepared to help them ease into it in a healthy way? Do you have any training for this kind of situation? Are you qualified to give the support and care they WILL need or are you just planning to say "Oh, you're positive, here's your 250, now go."?

 

I am not slamming you. I am genuinely concerned that you might be getting in situations you don't want to experience.

 

You are not the only man suffering from this fear. There are support groups, there's individual therapy, there are options. You deserve to live a full, exciting, relaxed, healthy life.

 

This ^^^^^^

[SteveEscort]

What I mean -- and you've said the same thing yourself -- is that proper precautions (such as the use of condoms) mitigates risk to the point where one's partner's status is irrelevant from a public health standpoint. (As in making it possible to have sex with men who are HIV positive and not worry that the virus will be transmitted.) If that weren't the case, then assuming everyone is HIV+ and using condoms isn't a sufficient answer.

 

As Juan points out, there's also the emotional aspect of it. But at that rate presumably the purpose of the test is to serosort. One can't be 100% sure of the other person's status anyway, given the existence of a window period in any test. If that's what's necessary to make someone feel more comfortable, that's their prerogative, but it also helps perpetuate the myth that "knowledge" of the other person's status provides extra protection.

 

 

Exactly. I competely agree

 

The test does not tell you anything of any use in that hour unless the escort and the client have abstained from sex for the window period. As I said in my post, if he wants that level of commitment, he needs to seek a sexual partner who is not reliant on the sex industry as a form of income.

 

Draker, of course thinks anyone refusing it has something to hide. No the test does that.... It hides the last few weeks sexual activity for a start.

 

Geez