Depression...

[Boston Guy]

When I let my dick lead me around, I make bad choices. So I am here to bounce ideas off of you before I go make more bad choices. I am 28 and have raging hormones so I am trying to reign them in and think with a clearer mind with your guidance.

 

Oh, gosh, I've got bad news for you!

 

When you are 78 and let your dick lead you around, you will still be making bad choices! You're a guy and while it does get a little easier when you get.. ahem.. as old as I am, we still need to try to think with our big head and not our little head.

[firsttimer]

home stretch... then I can call it a night and go to bed.

 

The real problem isn't that you're not having sex with hot A&F guys.

Although this is a problem still right? Wouldn't you want to have hot sex with an A&F model? Yes, this is not the underlying problem.

 

No, the problem is that you're alone.

Yup.

 

As I see it, you don't need a boyfriend, you need a friend. In fact, you need a bunch of friends because if you just found one gay friend, you're so needy right now what you'd probably overwhelm the poor guy and he'd run away screaming. LOL So you need some gay friends. And that six-word sentence is what I think is the real solution to the real problem that is haunting you.

 

...But you do need some gay friends.

And that, my friend, as far as I can see, is the problem in a nutshell.

I agree. I cannot share these things with my family now because there are other family issues with other family members that hinders me from sharing with them my struggles like I used to years ago. I cannot share with my friends because they are all straight and 1) I don't want them to know. 2) They aren't gay so they can't really understand exactly what I'm go through. A gay friend, however, can understand my gay feelings in a straight dominated world that isn't as tolerant as it would like to say it is.

 

But you need good gay friends -- emphasis on the plural -- who you can go to dinner with or have a drink with or laugh with and drool over beautiful men with.

It is great to drool over hot guys and be honest about the A&F guy I'm looking for without having to make up some hot actresses' name or answer the question why I'm not married yet.

 

And, sooner or later, one of those guys will be someone you like and who likes you and you'll find to your amazement that you suddenly seem to have a boyfriend.

Back up, back up. I think that's jumping a little too far forward for me at this point lol. That seems like light years away.

 

...no longer lonely. And when that day occurs, I want to you to remember back to yesterday, when you were so sad and depressed, and to realize how far you have come down the road toward happiness.

Already I look back at what I've learned from the mistakes I've made along this journey since I started and think of all these wonderful people I've met from the board trying to guide me towards happiness. I look forward to that happier day in the future when more of these questions about myself and answered as I continue to think about them.

 

Worse yet, if you meet a nice escort in your current state of mind, you're going to fall head over heels in love in about thirty seconds. Unfortunately, you'll have also fallen head over heels in love with someone who is emotionally unavailable to you so you'll be in even a worse spot that you are right now.

You hit the head on the mark. That is a huge danger. But I'm full of raging hormones and am thinking with my penis right now! Okay, okay I will try not to make rash decisions such as hiring all the escorts in Chicago and spending my life savings for an hour of transient good times.

 

When I was 28, I was working at a place where I had a good friend. She and I are still friends. I'd started coming out six months before but hadn't told anyone in my "normal life" what I was doing. One day, I was walking down a corridor and she was walking the other way. She stopped me and she said these words: "I don't know what you're doing that is making you so happy. I'm not sure that I should know what you're doing. But whatever it is that you are doing that is bringing a smile to your face these days, please keep doing it." And she smiled at me and gave me a little hug and walked away. And that is a day that I'll never forget for it was the moment that I knew for sure that I was on the right path for me.

 

And with that I will go to sleep with a smile on my face thinking of the hours of time you spent today writing all this for someone you've never met in your life and was just reaching out for a friend.

[Boston Guy]

[Guest TBinCHI]

 

Boston Guy,

All I can say to you is "AMEN". Your insight and your thoughts are amazing. And your ability to communicate them precisely and concisely is enviable. All of the things that you talked about today I learned the hard way, through all kinds of doubt and loneliness. I do hope that you are a therapist of some sort, because it is invaluable to know that someone else understands the struggle inherent in coming out.

 

The collective understanding by this thread's posters of what firstimer is going through says so much about the difficulty that we all are facing or have faced. At the end of the day, it is a good thing if we can make someone else's struggle a little bit easier.

[whipped guy]

Amen indeed!

 

Boston Guy, All I can say to you is "AMEN". Your insight and your thoughts are amazing. And your ability to communicate them precisely and concisely is enviable... I do hope that you are a therapist of some sort...

My thoughts exactly... simply amazing!

[Boston Guy]

TB,

 

Thank you for those kind words. And thank you, too, for taking the time to drive up to Chicago to spend some time with FT. It is clear that not only did he enjoy the time he spent with you but also that it was important to have someone who could sit down with him face to face. It was very kind of you to do that.

 

As for being a therapist, I am sorry to disappoint you. I've always thought that I'd make a poor therapist for they must have more patience than I myself do. Instead, I've learned from my own struggle to come out at a time when I hardly knew the word 'gay' but knew well words like 'fag' and 'queer' and also from the experiences of my friends over the last thirty years. We are all unique but there are many common threads in our stories.

 

In the end, what we are all seeking, rich and poor, famous and anonymous, young and old, is a bit of happiness, some love and some affection. There have been times in my life when I was desperately unhappy. Some of those times had to do with losing people to AIDS: my best friends, my lover, many of the people who made up the fabric of my day-to-day life. But those of us who were left supported each other and we muddled through.

 

When I was coming out, I felt many of the feelings that FT has described and I, too, was lonely and depressed. As KMEM says, that was the common experience in those days and unfortunately is still all too common. I felt in those days that I did not know one single "homosexual". It turned out that one of my best friends was gay but I didn't know that at the time. I felt totally alone in the world and there was no Internet or anyplace else to turn. I remember buying a gay novel in a bookstore and feeling mortified when the cashier turned it over and exposed the title. That was in 1979.

 

Eventually, in desperation, I found the courage to go to a gay resort and start talking to people. I was so desperate for companionship that I even stopped a guy on a bike and said to him "Excuse me, but are you gay?" (And yes, FT, he was cute. ) Fortunately, he was not only gay but kind and sympathetic and we talked for hours. He introduced me to other people who were also kind to a total stranger, who reached out to me in many ways and offered me friendship. Those people changed the course of my life and taught me a little of the meaning of "community" in the term "gay community". They showed me kindness and goodness and patience and took time out of their days to help me find the right path. And I vowed that if ever I were to find a gay man who was standing by the side of that road, saying "are you gay? Can you help me?" that I would not walk on by without doing what little I could to help.

 

Having been the beneficiary of such kindness, it seems the least I can do.

 

BG

[Guest TBinCHI]

Paying It Forward

 

BG,

The concept of paying it forward is rich indeed. I'm glad that you can give as well as you receive (pun intended!)!

TB

[HoseMaster]

Wow! Such a great thread! I really enjoyed the responses.

 

firsttimer,

I had the same problem as you as I was growing up. I was born into a Christian family, went to a Christian school, and still haven't come out. I don't go to church every Sunday, but every now and then I play the pipe organ there for various services. I didn't have a lot of friends in High School, and was the typical loner. I, too, felt suicidal at times. I remember my hormones raging in High School, and being attracted to the swimmers and water polo players, as you could always see their shirtless pictures in the yearbook! I would get "set-up" every so often with girls by family or friends, but of course it never worked out.

 

I didn't know what I wanted to do for a career, until one of my good friends led me on the path of becoming a firefighter. It took me awhile, but it is a career I'm proud to have gotten, and one I still enjoy. (No, I'm not the type that would look good in a calender, LOL.) It is also one of those careers where there is a lot of machismo floating around the firehouse. I've heard anti-gay slurs from some of my fellow firefighters, and have heard what a few of them have said about a couple of out-of-the-closet firefighters behind their backs. I believe part of me wishes to stay in the closet simply because it is less stress in an already stressful career.

 

I've even heard the anti-gay remarks from family and friends. I think they all believe that being gay is a choice. I've had most of these friends for a very long time, and part of me believes that by coming out will jeopardize that friendship. I guess I worry about how life would change if I did come out. Would it be better for me? Would I still have the same friends? How much of my family would still treat me the same?

 

For me, it works staying in the closet...for now. Do I get lonely? Sure. Do I hire escorts from time to time to satisfy my still-raging hormones? Sure. Do I still get depressed? Rarely. Am I still suicidal? No. That phase passed a long time ago.

 

Maybe part of my loneliness is alleviated through work. I live with a bunch of guys while I work at the fire station in 24-hour shifts, which ends up being at least 1/3 of the year. When I go home, I find stuff to do around the house, go to movies with friends, do construction projects for friends and family, and always try to stay busy. By the time I get home at night, I usually just have enough time to check email, some of my favorite sites like this, maybe rub one off (LOL), and then I just fall asleep. Would I like someone to snuggle up to and talk to as I fall asleep (as I've done and still do with a few of my favorite escorts on overnights)? Sure. I've just learned to deal with it though. Maybe I'm too picky, and am just too particular in whom I would like to share a bed with.

 

To sum it all up, just hang in there. Things get better. I know its hard for you now, but it was for me at one time too. Listen to the good people on this site, as we all care about you. If you lived in L.A., I'd probably take a walk with you too.

 

Well it's time for me to sign off, as I'm at the fire station now, and I'd like to try to get a little sleep before we get woken up!

[Guest RyanCade]

I agree, Boston Guy, That was a beautiful dissertation, touching, and heartfelt. You have articulately shared your personal experience; Your passion came through your words, perfect-Raw-Emotion. The inflection of the words you chose and the way you arranged them, touched my heart where we share a common bond. Relating to pain and true life experience with others is part of healing and you have definitely done your part..

 

This entire thread is amazing this is a perfect example of why I love this forum.. This is very therapeutic, exercising our intellect, reason, and emotion. Stimulating to say the least. There are something like 553 active members with wisdom, life experience, opinions, perspectives, and personalities. A valuable resource indeed.

 

Talk about a life line..

 

FirstTimer, I know you will look back on this one day and smile, I'm smiling just thinking about that day. and you are welcome to call me any time day or night if you need a friendly voice...

 

RC:)

[NYTomcat]

Let me just add my two cents. It was only about two months ago this newbie was in your position first timer (maybe worse I'm 40 not 28) I hired and while waiting came out to this forum. Many of the guys have become exactly what BG was saying. I needed gay friends. In those two months I've come out not only to the "strangers" on the MC (who I no longer consider strangers.. just strange) LOL But also to a family member who I am close too. The escort I hired has become a good friend and guide (Thanks Romann - PS Firsttimer just better hiring choices thats the key Im sure TB will hook you up right) I have made good friends here. some I have met, some not yet but I will. This in two months

 

What I didn't have was the strength to say back then what you did (Im depressed) Hell I was so lonely it was overwhelming. And I have more people in my life than grand central station has train riders. But no one knew me, the real me. Well FT now they do. You have had that face to face with TB (ps im jealous) My saviour in NY was PK (thanks purplekow) Believe me its a wild ride with highs and lows. but BG is absolutely dead on correct. you come out as much as you need to, just don't lie to yourself about what you need or who you are. and if you ever need to talk just write me. I'm older but on the same path. well none of us are on the same path but im in the same place.

[+ purplekow]

Thanks for the shout out Tom. I want to add my voice again and for the most part I agree with almost all of Boston Guys sage advice and in an earlier post I suggested getting out and meeting gay people and accepting help from all the different directions from which it may come. The one thing I would add though, there are gay couselors who may be able to help you more than the couselors you have seen. There are Gay Health Services in most large cities and while much of their work is with HIV + men, they may have names of counselors that are sensitive to the kind of struggle you are having. So, firsttimer, congratulations on the steps you have made. Boston Guy and TB thanks for helping so openly and selflessly. FT, don't discard the notion that professional services may be another way to get support. It may be a matter of finding the right counselor.

[firsttimer]

Thanks again for this enormous outpouring of support from everyone. I am so thankful for everyone's advice, thoughts, and support.

 

I have to bring up that I just met with Romann this morning. I emailed him in my desperation Saturday night and he had responded as well as read through this thread. I had just heard so many good things about him and he had been recommended by others and he was in Chicago so I thought I'd try to contact him. I was very blunt in my email that I had bad experiences and he was not my type but was desperate. TBinChi also helped me out by letting him know he met me in person (as if I were Romann I probably would think I'm some kind of crazied high maintenance client).

 

Romann had been following the thread and emailed me saying he would be happy to fit me in his schedule early this morning. So at 7:30 we met and talked for 2.5 hours at his hotel.

 

If that already doesn't say what a wonderful guy he is, to meet with me and just share with me his thoughts and his life experiences, I don't know what more wonderful of an escort you can find. He just listened and gave me advice. He made it clear that he didn't expect any money from this. He just wanted to talk and see if he could offer any more good advice or answer any questions too. He was awesome to talk to and I can't put into words my appreciation of him spending the time to do so. I'm lucky he was passing through town this week and offer me some of his time. I won't disclose everything he said as it is between us but he gave me more insight from his perspective. And I want to acknowledge him here too as he is very deserving of his Escort of the Year award. He is a professional at what he does and just a good person at heart.

 

So thanks again Romann for your time this morning and again to everyone else here!

[NYTomcat]

Remember when I said it was just about finding the right people.....

 

you just did. TB and Romann are two of the people I was referring to. You could not have had a better two voices to listen to and allow them to bring you out of your depression-lonliness. Now from someone who sees your position, dont take this to mean they are the end all of your journey. they are support and a step but if you feel yourself slipping professional help is a good choice as well. Take PK's advice and mix it all together. I have and its made a world of difference for me. Boston Guy has given great advice. coming out is a process of small steps that may never have you openly living some life that would make you feel wrong. its discovering who you are and learning to be comfortable in your individual skin.

 

No one can advise where that comfort level is except you. So congrats on taking a really hard step. I know knocking on that hotel room door was huge. believe me... I know. Romann practically had to text me through parking the car, the elevator, and down the hall. Buts its a journey your life will be all the better for.

 

Now when you are in DC you take the metroliner to this little town we call NYC and you look up your eastern bretheren. The Romann fan club headquarters. just pm me and I'll intoduce you to the gang. LOL

 

Really Congrats - its a good day, TB and Romann you two are the best.

Bostonguy - I'm gonna have to come to bean town, your posts were inspired.

[firsttimer]

Remember when I said it was just about finding the right people.....

You are totally right. Finding the right people to help you through this tough time is crucial. Who knows where'd I have gone if you all didn't step in and pull me out of that pit to live another day.

 

...coming out is a process of small steps that may never have you openly living some life that would make you feel wrong. its discovering who you are and learning to be comfortable in your individual skin.

It is about feeling more comfortable. You should have seen how scared and rigid I was in the room with Romann this morning. It can be intimidating when you're in the room with the Escort of the Year sitting next to you! Even by the end I'm sure he was thinking this must be the most nervous first timer ever as I still felt a little shaky hugging him as I left!

 

Romann practically had to text me through parking the car, the elevator, and down the hall.

Lol. I don't have texting ability on my cell phone but I did email him back and forth last night and call him this morning to make it to that door! He is so awesome about good communication.

 

Now when you are in DC you take the metroliner to this little town we call NYC and you look up your eastern bretheren. The Romann fan club headquarters. just pm me and I'll intoduce you to the gang. LOL

I will hold you to that promise! =)

[NYTomcat]

Oh I am laughing my ass off cause I don't think I could have crossed my arms any tighter when I first walked into that hotel room. I was just rigid in fear. I'm sure there are others here, and even some who will admit it, LOL that have felt or that way the first time they met an escort or had their first male to male experience. So come on guys lets hear the nervous horror stories (If you need more FT my review of Romann pretty much says it all) Something just broke after dinner with him. All my trepidation just flew away and I let it. My life has not been the same since. Just be careful there is a high that is inevitably followed by a low. I hit rock bottom after that experience. I was not just emotionally shaken I was rocked to my core which was something I wasn't prepared for. Romann and a few others on here (PK its all you baby) were instrumental in keeping me sane. which is why I'm saying keep writing here, find your own personal support group. and have fun read my signature line below. Refuse to starve.

 

PS I just got back from Disney, Hope you all like the new avatar, at least for now. im sure the cat will be back

[+ purplekow]

You know I saw someone with a Disney shirt and it had 4 characters Mickey Donald Pluto and Goofy. I mentioned that Pluto was my favorite. Then after your e mail last night, I know that Pluto is your favorite too, but I must say, that while I love Pluto,I have never done it doggy style in exactly the way you described.

[jackhammer91406]

A long Way

 

It is hard to relate how much this thread pleases me and why. For the OP, you got such great advice from BG and others. Try to step back from your position and see what they are referring to.

The great advice is also why I am so pleased with this thread. Over 7 years ago when I first joined here and went through my own severe depression, I began to use this MC as my therapy (along with professionals). The reaction I got here was much different. There was much more prolific negative comment with a smattering of positive advice.

 

Even so, some of the interaction here did allow me to begin to feel comfortable enough in my self to meet in the real world with members from the MC. Thus began my many trips to different cities and meeting up with posters whenever I traveled.

 

Those who know me know I have a strong background as a man of faith. It was a struggle for me to unlearn years of close-minded bad thinking and come to accept that God not only loved me as I am, but also intended me to be this way. I was able to learn that a life lived trying to be what others wanted was not a life lived as myself. It is a place each of us will decide for ourselves when we get there, but it never hurts to have an outside opinion based on experience and compassion.

 

At any rate, this is not my thread, it is the OP's thread. I am just happy to see the MC develop into a more supportive place than it once was.

[firsttimer]

Those who know me know I have a strong background as a man of faith. It was a struggle for me to unlearn years of close-minded bad thinking and come to accept that God not only loved me as I am, but also intended me to be this way. I was able to learn that a life lived trying to be what others wanted was not a life lived as myself. It is a place each of us will decide for ourselves when we get there, but it never hurts to have an outside opinion based on experience and compassion.

 

This is definitely a huge part of the struggle for me too. I have always grown up in the Christian church so a large part of my guilt comes from these ingrained parts of my personality and thoughts. As I've mentioned that I have met Christian counselors also, it is something I've been told time and time again that these feelings are wrong, sinful, and immoral. That has made me to sexually repressed as those are the only feeling I have. I don't have the attraction to girls that I'm told is the right feeling to have. Anyways it is a huge debate and something I think many people face since America is still a mostly Prostestant country.

 

At any rate, this is not my thread, it is the OP's thread. I am just happy to see the MC develop into a more supportive place than it once was.

 

You are more than welcome to say whatever else you want to add to the conversation as everyone's differing thoughts and ideas are what help us all identify in whatever part reverberates with our individual struggles.

[Guest TBinCHI]

PS I just got back from Disney, Hope you all like the new avatar, at least for now. im sure the cat will be back

 

I couldn't stop laughing when I scrolled down this page and saw your new avatar. There will have to be an AWFULLY good reason for you to bring back the cat. At least one that is as good as the reason for pluto. I'm laughing as I write this. You are wicked, my friend!

 

Sorry, FT, don't mean to hijack the thread, so back to you. I am really impressed at how everyone on here has your back. Just remember that there are lots of people in your corner.

[firsttimer]

I couldn't stop laughing when I scrolled down this page and saw your new avatar. There will have to be an AWFULLY good reason for you to bring back the cat. At least one that is as good as the reason for pluto. I'm laughing as I write this. You are wicked, my friend!

 

I'm still waiting for your explaination NYTomcat about this Pluto thing. I have several ideas but can only imagine when I hear the real story!

[NYTomcat]

I wasn't going to hijack your thread. I owe you pk. Watch your back LOL. But OK 2 months after Romann and yes I hooked up with the Guy who plays Pluto. Something I never would have had the balls to do before. Now after all the religious and moral discussion this seems quite low but you need to understand, just as you have religious misgivings about your feelings, I had personal issues that had me sworn off the life. I would not be who I as meant to be because of them. My experiences here have made me comfortable enough to overcome those issues and be the person I was meant to be. I have a long way to go. In fact the whole thing brings on regular panic attacks. But these guys the perfect supportive (degenerate ) guys have done more for me than 20 years of therapy. Now the trutth is without the professional help I would have been in no condition to be on this hooville train. I only. Post this now so you see there is light at the end of the tunnel ft. Just take it slow its a marathon not a sprint.

[Romann]

2 months after Romann and yes I hooked up with the Guy who plays Pluto.

 

I have created a monster! WATCH OUT WORLD because NYTomcat is on the prowl and he's going after Disney characters!

[MsGuy]

Romann, are Looney Tunes characters safe?

 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e2/Looney_Tunes_B%26W.jpg

[Romann]

Right!

 

Romann, are Looney Tunes characters safe?

 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e2/Looney_Tunes_B%26W.jpg

 

HAHA! You never know these days! That porky pig is looking mighty fine! Someone call out the National Guard to protect these childhood characters from the deviance of our dear friend NYTomcat!

 

I loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooove you NYTomcat!

[Guest greatness]

oh my

 

Thank you BG. You are just so sweet. My eyes hurt so I haven't all the post but I want to thank you for your love and generosity to FT. Romann you are so sweet to meet FT in person and make him comfortable.