Chemistry Has Nothing To Do With It

[Guest N]

In another thread the question came up as to whether chemisty has a place in the escort / client relationship.

 

Assuming that chemistry is not a euphamism for dirty or disgusting, the answer should be a clear NO!

 

The escort, who is charging top dollar and holds himself out to be a professional has no business even thinking of the word.

 

There is a difference between hiring someone for a few bucks to give or receive a quick blow-job or fuck and hiring an experience. The first are contracted to be nothing more than a performance of a sex act. The latter is done with the expectation of the client that there will be more than that.

 

$50 for sex should not buy the client the same thing as the rates being charged by the "top-of-the-line" escorts should buy.

 

We, the clients, are buying a fantasy. That fantasy can and often does include, affection, caring and the illusion that we are special to the escort. When these are lacking the question has to be asked...what are we paying so much for?

 

A professional escort (called a courtesan in the past) should be able to give his client the illusion of specialness.

 

This is not to say that those escorts who are very clear that they don't this or that are not being professional. As long as the client knows IN ADVANCE that the escort has limitations there is a choice by the client to accept this as the contract or not and go elsewhere.

 

It is when we, the client, have been clear about our desires, i.e. kissing, being topped, being top, affection, cuddling, etc., and the escort does not provide the agreed upon services that we have the right to be very upset.

 

For an escort not to be able to be or stay hard is inexcusable. If this is the case they certainly have no right in expecting their full fee. For an escort to say they deep kiss and not do so is lying. (If the client has bad breath...for God's sake give him a mint and get on with it!) If they can't perform as agreed they should get the client off and not charge their full rate. Why should the client pay for less than was agreed upon?

 

To say that there was no chemistry (barring a client's wanting violence, being dirty, or requesting services that are outside an agreed upon norm) is to admit that the escort is not professional or very good at his job.

 

The best escorts (a personal list includes, Scott Matthews, Troy (NY), Reece Rothmeier, Michael Brandon, Collin (NY) and the infamous Sean), work hard to give the illusion that they actually like and enjoy their time with the client. They perform as agreed upon and certainly give the illusion that they are happy to be with you.

 

Let's be realistic. To expect friendship, caring and love from an escort is to be unrealistic. These guys are being paid to give the impression of some or even all of the above. For us to expect that it is real is for us to be naive. For us to expect to receive what was agreed upon is not a matter of chemistry. It is, however, a realistic expectation IF the escort is doing his job.

 

The escorts who out and out lie about what they will do - Justin Powers comes to mind - is a rip off and unfair to the escorts that are trying to do their best.

 

Realistically, the vast majority of escorts fall into the middle ground where they are vague about what they will or will not do or actually delude themselves that they have the fiat to do only what they feel like without regard to the promises that were inferred to the client.

 

I use male4male to try to cull the best. While not always possible it certainly beats spinning the wheel and taking fully untested chances.

 

Thoughts?

[Guest regulation]

N, I can't really disagree with anything you've said, but I think you are leaving something out.

 

Some of the people who rely on escorts for sex do so because they lack the self-confidence to enter into normal relationships. When an escort or anyone else mistreats them, they are likely to blame themselves or, if you prefer, "chemistry" rather than the other person. It's just another aspect of the emotional problem that got them into the situation in the first place. You seem to be saying that when escorts explain a client's dissatisfaction with an appointment by citing "chemistry" they are rationalizing their own inability or unwillingness to do what they were paid to do. Fine. But when clients use that explanation? I think they are people who are accustomed to blaming themselves for the way others treat them.

[Guest N]

Regulation,

 

Well said.

 

N

[Guest ChicagoCorey]

I think "chemistry" as it's used as a euphemism on this site, often deals not with physical/hygiene issues, but with deep things that people really don't want to get into. It's really easy for an escort to say that the "chemistry" was off to get themselves out of looking bad. Similarly, it's much easier for an escort to say that the "chemistry" was off when the client acts in such a way that it makes it impossible to live up to expectations; for example, if a guy treats me like dirt, it's really hard to later be "cuddly" or "affectionate". Likewise, if someone is looking for me to be passionate, it's hard to be that way if my partner is just lying there.

 

Like almost everything, it's an issue of communication. I agree -- using "chemistry" as a catch-all is lazy and certainly unprofessional.

 

-------

chicagocorey@yahoo.com

get to know me/updated frequently

http://www.geocities.com/chicagocorey

[Rod Hagen]

>For an escort not to be

>able to be or stay

>hard is inexcusable. If this

>is the case they certainly

>have no right in expecting

>their full fee.

 

>Thoughts?

 

Here is a perfect example of a person who can not imagine that other people wouldn't seek the exact same thing he's seeking from an experience.

 

Guess what? Some clients are not at all interested in penis activity. They don't want to top, they don't want to bottom. If they were hoping one or the other was going to happen, but the escort's flight was long and late (or his Allegra was a bit off today) so he goes soft quickly, or the escort's stomach is upset so he can't bottom for long, there are actually clients who won't treat that escort like an asshole. These people want to be held, kissed, hugged, cuddled, in short made to feel like a human being. But this poster is all, or largely, about the dick so everyone else must be too. Right?

 

http://www.rodhagen.com

"I will seek out these androids, and I

will break them with my bare hands!"

[Guest Jason Reardone]

http://www.JasonReardoneEscort.com

 

"""These people want to be held, kissed, hugged, cuddled, in short made to feel like a human being. But this poster is all, or largely, about the dick so everyone else must be too. Right?""

 

Rod, I started to respond to this earlier but I was so angry that I had to log off and cool down a bit. You said it perfectly so many clients just want to be validated, held, made to feel significant in some way. Some just need their brains fxxked out but that's another story. Thank you for saying this, it needed to be said and I was too chicken. <sighing in relief -jason>

[Guest scrtlovr]

I agree with a lot of what you say, however, I wouldn't completely rule chemistry out. I have hired a lot of escorts in NYC and if, thanks to this board, I've been able to limit bad experiences (though I've had my share of those too)I found that there were times I've had better sex with escorts that may not really look as hot as I'd like them to(this, of course being completely subjective) and yet had the time of my life and vice versa, being with an incredible looking escort who "delivers" all that was discussed and yet, something's missing and I do believe that that something is chemistry (Incidentally, I also agree with you on Reece, he is by far the best escort I ever hired - and I'm not even into SM - but he's got it all: attitude, body, looks and brains...).

 

Whether that chemistry is real, or purely "manufactured" by the escort and my (the client's) willingness to buy into it - no pun intended!- doesn't matter, the fact remains that sometimes that chemistry works better than others which proves to me that more is involved than just the escort's skill. So I suppose, if we want to create a formula:

Chemistry = Escort skill + Client willingness to "play along"

+ A little magic.

 

And it's that little magic that makes all the difference in the world. Oh my, I've just turned chemist, philosopher and hopeless romantic all in one post!

[Guest jizzdepapi]

RE: Chemistry Has EVERYTHING to Do with It

 

Hi N. Interesting thread. Please don't take my comments personally as I don't know you and assume you have only the best of intentions. I also hope you regularly have a great time with escorts.

 

I don't look to escorts for any illusion of affection so am coming from a different place than you and some other posters. I do worry that the mindset you describe is the breeding ground for escort stalkers and malcontents.

 

There certainly are basic needs we all experience, such as the need to be loved and to let down our guard, to relax with another individual, to banter casually, to enjoy movies together, to share a laugh, etc. To spend time with an escort, for many of us, is to spend time with someone who is physically out of our league, although that may not have been true in the past. In reality, if the client is not meeting most of these needs with friends, both the client and the escort are probably headed for trouble. To me the casual moments are enough but I recognize them for what they are.

 

I pay escorts a high rate because they deliver sexually; I'm impressed that they can do this with people to whom they are not sexually attracted and for this they should be well compensated. I've had a few disastrous bargains and will pay more not to have to endure these dissapointing dates.

 

And you are right about being upfront about what an escort will and will not do on a date. I do expect kissing from an escort (none of that kiss-your-aunt-on-the-cheek now stuff here) but other then that I don't require that they reciprocate in any sexual activity; I know that's not the norm out here.

 

Your comment about mints and bad breath is offbase, I think. A mint is NOT sufficient to wipe out a dinner cooked with garlic, someone's breath after a day at work, and certainly a smoker's breath. Brushing and mouthwash do the trick. The same goes for taking a shower, with lots of scrubbing. My dates are in hotels but I hope clients are provdiing fresh, clean sheets. These are minimal steps in preparation for the dates many of us went on with boys/men of whom we were enamored. They are still minimal but necessary steps for paid encounters.

 

Your post doesn't leave a lot of room for escorts to be human beings and also doesn't allow for potential stalking/disruptive behavior for which I'm sure many escorts need to be on guard.

 

That's my take on this subject.

 

Best, Jizz

[Guest N]

Rod,

 

I suggest you re-read the post.

 

N

[+ Lucky]

RE: Chemistry Has EVERYTHING to Do with It

 

N and Regulation have a very good thread here and I hope it stays on message and free from rancor. I do agree with Jizz, though, that Altoids doesn't cut garlic or other halitosis problems.

Rod, ye of such a good name for an escort, must realize that the penis is an important part of this, more for some than others. But even if a client doesn't want to get penetrated, the sight of a powerful erect cock certainly enhances the experience. And if the escort has a headache, stomach ache, hangover, or whatever, he should not keep the appointment, or if he has been flown in, compensate the client in some way

[Rod Hagen]

>Rod,

>

>I suggest you re-read the post.

>

>

>N

 

Actually, I quoted directly from it.

 

http://www.rodhagen.com

"I will seek out these androids, and I

will break them with my bare hands!"

[Guest jeffOH]

RE: Chemistry Has EVERYTHING to Do with It

 

When I communicate with a potential new client by phone or e-mail, there's very little I will "agree" to do. I don't like to

discuss specific sexual acts over the phone or by e-mail. And

yes, CHEMISTRY does have something to do with it. I don't have to

have physical chemistry with a client to create the illusion that

I'm really into them, but if a client has a condescending attitude or one of, "I'm paying you, so you do exactly what I want." Well, that's not going to work with me. There's a minimum

of what I will do with some clients, but I tend to do more with

clients that I've been seeing over a period of time.

 

The good thing about this review site is that clients can get an

idea of some of the things that you get into from your reviews,

but the bad part is that we can't always recreate exactly what

a client has read that you've done with another client. Escorts

who are truly good at their profession are able do this most of the time. And you can tell who can and who can't by the consistency of their reviews.

 

Jeff4hire@aol.com

[Guest N]

RE: Chemistry Has EVERYTHING to Do with It

 

Jizz,

 

No offense meant and none taken!

 

You do bring up the question of the client's responsibility beyond the obvious of paying as agreed.

 

I guess that cleanliness of breath and person are so ingrained in me that it is hard to imagine anyone not having the common courtesy to brush their teeth, wash their body and douche when indicated.

 

A clean place, sheets, towels, etc. - either the client's or the escort's - should be an obvious given. I may be a bit naive here myself, as I guess judging from some of the places I have "visited" I should know better. I am sure it can be the same on the client side. Pity.

 

My point is that it does not matter what a specific person is looking for. Rather it is about fulfilling a contract - whatever Anyway, thanks for your response.

[Guest WorldEscrt Sean]

N, thanks for the vote but I have to disagree with you on this one. Chemistry has everything to do with it. One reason we had such a great time was the chemistry. You were personalable, clean, funny and a delight to be with. You didn't treat me like a hooker.

[Guest TFNH]

I cringe when I read this, but only because I agree with you and find it terribly sad.

[Guest TFNH]

Unfortunately, the "chemistry" that people speak of probably has as many definitions as there are people. I do think, however, that the chemistry a client seeks with an escort is closely connected to their expectations, expressed or unexpressed, and that when the behavioral expectations are not met then all of a sudden it becomes a chemistry problem. And one that probably could have been avoided had expectations been clear and realistic. Personally, I look to an escort for nothing more than convenient and decent(not great)sex - not some life reaffirming and validating experience, not acceptance, not friendship. Those are all things readily available to me in other areas of my life.

[Guest Kenny]

RE: Chemistry Has EVERYTHING to Do with It

 

"But even if a client doesn't want to get penetrated, the sight of a powerful erect cock certainly enhances the experience. And if the escort has a headache, stomach ache, hangover, or whatever, he should not keep the appointment, or if he has been flown in, compensate the client in some way"

 

Very well said. The last 3 escorts I hired all failed to achieve an erection. Each said they couldn't understand why. I wrote a thread about this and it elicited many responses. After reading all the responses I came to the conclusion that it was NOT MY FAULT (as I originally thought) and that the "chemistry" issue was NOT THE CAUSE of the flaccid dick.I strongly suspect that it was a previous appointment immediately prior to our appointment.

I never discussed the impotence issue with the agency that represented them and paid them their full fee. Everything else about the encounter was satisfactory BUT I did expect an erection. From now on, I will make it clear ahead of time that "erections" are expected. I still don't know how to approach the issue without sounding demanding or arrogant. Any suggestions on how to do this "gracefully".

[Guest TFNH]

RE: Chemistry Has EVERYTHING to Do with It

 

> To spend

>time with an escort, for

>many of us, is to

>spend time with someone who

>is physically out of our

>league.

 

This may be true, but it seems like it could lead to trouble and leave one feeling less about himself after. It would seem to only reinforce the sense of being undesireable. I prefer to be with escorts that are in my "league", i.e., looks, etc, on a par with guys I date. I doubt that I'd be at all comfortable dating anyone that I felt was out of my league, escort or otherwise

[marc anthony]

Interesting thread. And I will start by saying that I don't completely agree. And the perspective comes from whether you primarily hire an escort for sex or for companionship or both.

 

It is true that if you hire an escort exclusively for sex, and you tell them upfront, "I want to top you, and I want you moan and talk dirty to me while I am doing it," and the escort says ok... then chemistry might have nothing to do with it.

 

But if you hire the escort for more than that... like an evening of fun... a show, dinner, cuddling in the room, and then sex... or even a travel weekend... then chemistry is VERY important. Can you converse? Do you have similar interests? Are you comfortable being seen with each other in public?

 

I liken your argument to a patient choosing a doctor. Techincally, you hire a physician to help you get well or be well. For some, it is adequate if they do their job... and "bedside manner" or chemistry is not an issue. For others, who need physicians for emotional support as well, these intangibles are everything. The gay community should be especially sensitized to these issues, as they often search out "gay-friendly" physicians for their medical care, reluctant to discuss their behavior with others. But in truth, any physician could technically take care of them. Only the CHEMISTRY wouldn't be there.

 

I hire escorts for the complete fantasy. For the companionship, the sex, and even the long-term relationship (communicating on-line, planning future appointments and activities online). So my escorts have to meet my sexual wants (be cute twinky bottom boys), of course... and initially that may have nothing to do with chemistry. But to become a "regular", a "repeat", a travel companion, a house guest, chemistry is everything. And I have found that friendships can develop (in the same way you can become "friends" with your physician), and certainly you and the escort can grow to genuinely like each other as people. And most importantly I have found, that the sex and the whole escort experience is even better when this happens!

 

Finally, I do view escorts as human beings, even if I am paying them. I have concerns for their feelings, as well as my own. So if I can sense that an escort is not happy, even if he is very professional about it, it makes me less happy myself. And I would hope if the escort sensed that I was not happy, that it would concern him. Either certainly detracts from the overall experience. To me, connecting on that very basic human emotional plane of, "you know, I really like you..." is basic to the success of all relationships, including escort-client ones.

[Guest N]

Sorry, Rod.

 

I meant ALL of it.

 

Taken out of context you do, however, have a point.

 

N

[Rod Hagen]

The original poster, N, simply meant that Chemistry, actually the lack of chemistry, is not an acceptable excuse for shortchanging a client. His post would have been better titled "Lack of Chemistry is no excuse". I don't think he thinks that chemistry is unimportant in the overall meeting.

 

Obviously, the 24 hour appointment I had with a 27 year old first-timer in July, where we spent the entire afternoon ridding rollercoasters, would not have worked without 'chemistry'. In bed we were also compatible, but that is something different. Likewise, if N was interested in taking an escort to dinner before being plowed, I think he'd want good chemistry. But that is not what N was talking about.

 

However, I still think he has difficulty imagining people not thinking like he does. He even said something along those lines. I'm the same way, actually. It's hard for me to put myself in other peoples shoes, and I actaully have to make a concerted effort to do so (I'm talking about 'in life' not in escorting).

 

Anyway, I hope this averts any blow-ups on this post of N's. To reiterate "chemistry" is important, but lack of it is not an excuse. At least that is what I think he meant.

 

 

http://www.rodhagen.com

"I will seek out these androids, and I

will break them with my bare hands!"

[Guest N]

Thanks Rod.

 

N

[Guest DCescortBOY]

threatening to shoot you or break your knees gives you the illusion that you're special???

by all means, continue patronizing sean then!

 

actually, except for the bit about sean, i totally agree with what you've said. chemistry isn't a factor. that being said, there ARE times when the two people involved will JUST NOT HAVE FUN, regardless of the escort's acting abilities. when that happens, i'd say "discount the fee & don't prolong a bad situation".

[Guest DCescortBOY]

RE: Chemistry Has EVERYTHING to Do with It

 

oh lord, the end of the world must be nigh...

i agree with jizz!

someone PLEASE come shoot me. wait, sean is good at that (so he CLAIMS, like many other things)... chop chop... one ticket from SAN to DCA please! oh, we'll have to deal with the firearm permit...

[Guest jizzdepapi]

I will own your sorry ass!

 

You will bow before your Master!

 

just kidding. good to see we're speaking about, if not yet to, each other.

 

Regards,

Jizzofwaywardescorts