someone lost their head

[Guest EvilSwine]

Matt-

 

If Gene Siskel said something today, I'd CERTAINLY pay attention. He's been dead for several years and if he had anything to say, it might be important..heh.

[HooBoy]

LAST EDITED ON May-10-01 AT 12:54PM (EST)[p]>This story is really crazy.....here is

>my experience and My opinion....

>

...I will never

>trust him anymmore.

>

>Stephan Lacoste

>1-310-739-7842

>http://www.stephanlacoste.com

>http://www.eboysvideo.com

 

Stef,

Thank you for your support.

 

I want to point out that when Stef and I first met, he had no idea who I was - for at least two meetings.

 

Now when we meet, I have to wear my mask, my shorts and black ankle socks and I speak with a heavy Algerian accent so he doesn't recognize me. :-)

 

HooBoy

Email: HooBoy@male4malescorts.com

[Guest CZ]

Someone lost a couple of messages

 

Interesting reading, SLaCoste's memories of BillyBoy et al. While I suspect it's all factually true, I'm not sure if most (or any) of it has much bearing on the matter at hand.

 

Let's see now: Billy is a faux-twink who wears a hair-piece (should a toupee or the like really be called a 'wig'?); he's rather devious in dealing with potential rivals; he tries for freebies from fellow-escorts; he sometimes behaves like a spoiled brat in public; and he and his ex think rather poorly of one another.

 

Does any of this invalidate what he has to say against Hooboy? His expose (which, by the way, appeared not here but on his own website) includes claims that Hooboy uses male4malescorts to play political games with those involved, using his power to help or hinder business as a way of intimidating escorts (to his personal benefit), deliberately ignoring reviews unfavorable to his pets-of-the-moment, not really verifying reviews (despite his claims), and grossly exaggerating the time and expense he puts into his purportedly altruistic work as webmaster--as opposed to the personal jollies & perks he gets out of it.

 

In post #27 Hooboy, after quoting LaCoste's very long post #24 in toto (in case anyone missed it, I guess) seems to be assuring us that he kept his icognito through two sessions with him, just as he told us he did when first test-driving BillyBoy years ago. Yes, but so what? Actually, the real interest his post has for me is that odd mention of an 'Algerian accent.' It made me wonder if he's implying (shades of WorldEscort Sean!)that he's fluent in French.

 

Finally, what happened to the two posts in between? Am I miscounting, or have #25 & 26 disappeared? (Or were they ever there?)

[Guest Tampa Yankee]

RE: Someone lost a couple of messages

 

So, just when and where did your ox get gored by Hoo?????

It would really help to know the source of your deep feelings... given the energy you contintue to expend on trashing Hoo.

[Guest Stephan-Lacoste]

RE: Someone lost a couple of messages

 

We need everything to make the world

Poor CZ , your life must be complicated....

 

Stephan Lacoste

1-310-739-7842

http://www.stephanlacoste.com

[Guest CZ]

RE: Someone lost a couple of messages

 

I usually don't answer content-free posts such as Tampa's & Lacoste's latest (both of them feeble variants on the old get-a-life-loser theme), but I'll make an exception in Tampa's case. (Can't reply to Lacoste, though, since I don't know what his post means.)

 

Tampa, neither a gored ox nor excess energy were needed for me to point out that L's first post & Hooboy's reply have virtually nothing to do with this particular topic. And if, in order to demonstrate that, I provide a quick reminder of what Billyboy actually said, it hardly make sense for you to complain that I'M trashing Hooboy.

 

It's true I'm no fan of his, but I'm not the one making the charges. (And, by the way, they're not as trivial as you seem to think, and they certainly haven't been refuted. In fact, everything H has offered along those lines just makes him seem more and more like the phony he's accused of being.) Trashing the messenger doesn't change the message one iota.

[Guest Esc_Tracker]

RE: Someone lost a couple of messages

 

>It's true I'm no fan of

>his, but I'm not the

>one making the charges.

>(And, by the way, they're

>not as trivial as you

>seem to think, and they

>certainly haven't been refuted. In

>fact, everything H has offered

>along those lines just makes

>him seem more and more

>like the phony he's accused

>of being.) Trashing the

>messenger doesn't change the message

>one iota.

 

(sigh)

 

OK, let's look at these charges that are "not as trivial as (we) seem to think".

 

>Hooboy uses male4malescorts to play political games with those involved,<

 

What exactly are we to make of this accusation? It might sound bad, but what does it really mean? Sounds like an unverifiable slur to me.

 

>using his power to help or hinder business as a way of intimidating escorts (to his personal benefit),<

 

And what exactly is this "power"? Can Billyboy or you site a case where HooBoy has added, edited, altered or excluded a review for "personal benefit"? Let's be clear here: what did he do *exactly* and what was the benefit he derived from it *exactly*?

 

>deliberately ignoring reviews unfavorable to his pets-of-the-moment,<

 

Could it be that HooBoy is concerned about the possibility of some ethically-challenged reviewers posting fake negative reviews (as Billyboy has admitted to doing)? Is it unreasonable for him to exercise skepticism with respect to negative reviews that just don't jive with his personal knowledge or experience, or with the bulk of reviews concerning that escort? No one has ever accused HooBoy of blocking a *favourable* review even for sworn ennemies no matter how suspect. It seems clear, that he justifiably applies a higher standard of credibility to negative reviews, precisely because they can be disproportionately damaging. I guess that somehow makes him an evil conniving meanie in your books.

 

>not really verifying reviews (despite his claims),<

 

He verifies some when he has the time and the means. He cannot verify all. Has he ever claimed to do more than this?

 

>and grossly exaggerating the time and expense he puts into his purportedly altruistic work as webmaster--as opposed to the personal jollies & perks he gets out of it.<

 

Please quote HooBoy chapter and verse on precisely how much time and expense goes into maintaining this site, and demonstrate how these claims are an exageration. While you are it, please provide us chapter and verse for HooBoy stating that he does all this just out of altruism.

 

It's easy to knock down a straw man. If we are going to fling and give credence to accusations, let's at least have some specific instances to discuss instead of just vague slurs.

 

Oh, and BTW, I am not an escort. I have never sent HooBoy any money or received any money from him. I have no vested interest in who is right or who is wrong here. All I notice is that HooBoy's critics are high on spleen and low on verifiable details. x(

 

Esc-Tracker

[Guest Tampa Yankee]

RE: Someone lost a couple of messages

 

As long as you are speaking of content-free posts, you should include your own, that is if we are considering facts and not just innuendo and repeated slurs of others.

 

Moving on (I don't expect any more of a response than I or others have received to date)... Your response still begs the question: What moves you to such lengths to trash HooBoy? Tell us so we can appreciate all of the trouble you have put yourself to. I would think that you would want to community to know how you have been wronged.

 

So please... provide us will at least one content-filled post.

[Justice]

RE: Someone lost a couple of messages

 

No one but BillyBoy and HooBoy know exacly what happened between the two of them. I'm sure that they both feel that their version their very public and very ugly dispute is the "truth". You have to take what the two of them say about each other with a grain of salt. Why are you so quick to believe BillyBoy's version? Also, BillyBoy chose to announce the launching on his website on HooBoy's site. He made the announcement under several screen names and, initially, identified himself as "a former escort who knew the truth about HooBoy." (His initial posts were pulled by HooBoy.) The fact that he didn't identify himself, at first, tells me that he has very questionable motives and I've said so -- several times. BillyBoy can say what ever he wants about his version of "the truth". However, he should be man enough to identify himself. Several posts have noted that people haven't been able to access BillyBoy's web site for a couple of days. That also speaks volumes about him. I would take everything that HE has to say with a very, very, VERY big grain of salt.

[Guest Stephan-Lacoste]

RE: Someone lost a couple of messages

 

This is the only problem here.... he can't provide us anything.

Well the poor CZ , look at him he can't even understand what I'm saying, when everybody else does.... What a shame..

Unless he is being a Smart " cul" I would say

 

Stephan Lacoste

1-310-739-7842

http://www.stephanlacoste.com

[Guest CZ]

RE: Someone lost a couple of messages

 

I'm afraid, Tampa, I have less energy than you credit me with, particularly as regards trying to make you understand a simple point. But let me try one last time.

 

First, notice that I didn't chime in on this thread until more than two dozen posts had accumulated, and only after M. Lacoste (a Billyboy for the new millenium?) had offered his strange words of support for the embattled webmaster--followed immediately by a posting from the grateful webmaster himself. It was because neither actually addressed the problem--Billyboy's damaging allegations--that I finally threw in my two cents. In other words, had those two posts NOT appeared, I probably would have gone on ignoring the thread.

 

I am not Hooboy's accuser; Billy is. And it's not up to me to substantiate the claims any more than it's up to Hooboy to disprove them. HOWEVER (and here's the point again, Tampa, put as simply as I know how): if Hooboy chooses NOT to refute Billy in all this, as is his right, he and his allies really ought to refrain from any further comment, don't you think? Just let it go! A barrage of rambling irrelevancies and grade-school cattiness only worsens the very suspicions Billy raised in the first place.

 

Finally, Tampa, I'm afraid I can't help you in your career move from Russian novelist to psychotherapist beyond suggesting that you start by looking deeply into your own psyche. Unless I've misunderstood your repeated question to me, you seem to think that ANY negative criticism (indeed, dare I say it, even any skepticism) about a person's motives and behavior HAS to be an act of revenge, and nothing else. This curious preoccupation with past grievances and gored oxen tells me more about you than I really care to know. It also suggests that I'd be unlikely to be restored to emotional and cognitive good health by going to you for treatment.

[Guest Stephan-Lacoste]

RE: Someone lost a couple of messages

 

"First, notice that I didn't chime in on this thread until more than two dozen posts had accumulated, and only after M. Lacoste (a Billyboy for the new millenium?) had offered his strange words of support for the embattled webmaster--followed immediately by a posting from the grateful webmaster himself. It was because neither actually addressed the problem--"

 

YOu are worst than I thought.... But I guess nobody can change the way you are.

If You really want to keep that thread straight on the subject why could not you just stay quiet and keep your comment for yourself .... You might have forgotten ...

"(Can't reply to Lacoste, though, since I don't know what his post means.)"

You personnally did that on purpose.

So now be focus on the thread instead of saying that kind of comments... thanks

 

 

 

Stephan Lacoste

1-310-739-7842

http://www.stephanlacoste.com

[Guest regulation]

>All right you are now being

>sent to the 'fun stuff'

>category, do not return until

>you have read everything there

>and can recite it blindly.

>

>Matt(disciplinarian)

 

 

I'm not going to your "fun stuff" thread because a bunch of turgid one-liners about dicks and asses does not interest me. Threads like that make me think of what would happen if one of the networks decided to revive the Merv Griffin Show, invited only middle-aged gay entertainers as guests, and removed all censorship. It's a chilling thought.

 

I would like to express appreciation for your post on the thread about "first times" for clients and escorts. It was an interesting story and had the ring of truth to it. And it's the only post I've ever seen from you that read as if written by a real person rather than by a gay version of Joey Bishop.

[Guest jackson6]

Stephan,when you saw Billy in Hooboys room last April in Las Vegas didn't you wonder who was paying for his travel,and time.

Or even why he was there in the first place.

 

If you are going to tell a story give the hole story not just the readers digest version, many facts are always left out which affect the outcome.

[Guest Esc_Tracker]

With full respect, if you are going to write something like this, why do you think you have to write this publicly rather than privately? Believe me, I am no more fond up of this kind of juvenile humour than you are, but some people are into it, and Matt was simply trying to do his best to make this list more enjoyable. People who mean well do not deserve to be taken down a notch publicly in this way. For once, I agree with your sentiments, but I just think they were inappropriately expressed here.

 

Just so you don't think I am on your case. Let me describe what happens on lists of this nature distressingly frequently. Because it's a lightly moderated forum, some people feel free to be unpleasant, fling insults and cut each other down. This turns many people off, and these just leave the list. Their departure leads to an increase in the proportion of negative posts. More people leave until the list consists exclusively of whiners, fault finders, and critics along with the odd temporary newbie who finds himself there by mistake. Then the list dies.

 

I hope this is not your aim. I think you have real points to make. Often I find them valid. But they usually have a harsh personalized edge to them. I am sure you think your post above was a balance of praise and criticism, but that's not how it has come across. Even though I broadly agree with you, I ended up feeling sorry for Matt and irritated at your way of making what is, after all, a valid point.

 

There is some irony in my dissing you here about dissing others. I recognize this, and I would have emailed you privately, if it weren't for the fact that you are far from being the only or even the worst offender. Others need to read this and recognize themselves.

 

Before lashing out we all need to ask "Is this how I would like this or a similar point to be made to me?", "Is there a more tactful and pleasant, but equally effective way I can make my point?" or, more cynically perhaps "Am I going to convince more people by being aggressive and hurtful, or by appearing helpful, understanding, lighhearted and pleasantly witty?", "Can I get my opponent to laugh at himself and so change his point of view, or do I have to crush him utterly before he will see the folly of his ways?"

 

Please, guys, let's all try to be polite and courteous while expressing and holding to our opinions, and let's show others the respect we think we, if not they, deserve.

 

Esc-Tracker

[Justice]

>>Before lashing out we all need

>to ask "Is this how

>I would like this or

>a similar point to be

>made to me?", "Is there

>a more tactful and pleasant,

>but equally effective way I

>can make my point?" or,

>more cynically perhaps "Am I

>going to convince more people

>by being aggressive and hurtful,

>or by appearing helpful, understanding,

>lighhearted and pleasantly witty?", "Can

>I get my opponent to

>laugh at himself and so

>change his point of view,

>or do I have to

>crush him utterly before he

>will see the folly of

>his ways?"

>

>Please, guys, let's all try to

>be polite and courteous while

>expressing and holding to our

>opinions, and let's show others

>the respect we think we,

>if not they, deserve.

 

 

You took the words right out of my keyboard. I couldn't agree with you more.

[Guest Stephan-Lacoste]

>Stephan,when you saw Billy in Hooboys

>room last April in Las

>Vegas didn't you wonder who

>was paying for his travel,and

>time.

>Or even why he was there

>in the first place.

>

>If you are going to tell

>a story give the hole

>story not just the readers

>digest version, many facts are

>always left out which affect

>the outcome.

 

I have No Idea of who paid his travel at the first place, because I did not know I was going to see him there.And second of all , that question never came to my mind. LIke I said ,I was not very happy to see him because I wanted to Have a good time, between adults, and Knowing BillyBoy around Us would have made it Harder.

I really don't think that BillyBoy was getting paid to be over there, because He had some clients lined up and at severals time, Hooboy , by being Too nice, proposed him to use his room While he was gone, to do a call.

Hooboy went over his way to accept and understand Billy's attitude, which is something i would have never been able to do. He did everything in his possible to make him happy, because BillyBoy could not stop complaining like a kid.

 

Now I don't know what You are saying by

">If you are going to tell

>a story give the hole

>story not just the readers

>digest version"

I can't remember very well of which day it has been, which room number it was, that kind of things.

Oh well, something you might be happy to know, If you are into deep story, Hooboy at that time had a Nextel phone, and did not have his charger with him, other that the car charger. So I proposed him to do it in my car while we were all together. Of course I did not charge him for it.....

 

Let me know if you have something else you want to know. But it seems that you also know the story as well........

 

Stephan Lacoste

1-310-739-7842

http://www.stephanlacoste.com

http://www.eboysvideo.com

[Guest Tampa Yankee]

I know this will reflect poorly on me... but it won't be the first time.

 

I got a kick out of Matt's post -- just the right kind of light hearted respite from the goings-on needed at that time -- but then I am probably biased. Ummm... yes, I'm definitely biased. :-)

[Guest regulation]

>Matt

>was simply trying to do

>his best to make this

>list more enjoyable. People

>who mean well do not

>deserve to be taken down

>a notch publicly in this

>way. For once, I

>agree with your sentiments, but

>I just think they were

>inappropriately expressed here.

>

 

Since Matt ends every post with a link to his website and since his posts chide people for focussing on the fact that many of the reviews here are false, I assumed he was trying to advertise himself and to stop people from focussing on the fact that many of the reviews here are false. How silly of me.

 

>There is some irony in my

>dissing you here about dissing

>others. I recognize this, and

>I would have emailed you

>privately, if it weren't for

>the fact that you are

>far from being the only

>or even the worst offender.

> Others need to read

>this and recognize themselves.

>

 

There are a couple of reasons why I think that "irony" is not the right word to use in connection with your actions. One is that you yourself have engaged in exactly the sort of behavior for which you are now criticizing me in other threads. Another is that there's an excellent example of nasty bickering in posts ## 28 - 38 of this thread. It involves TY and Lacoste and you also. But in those posts you and the other two are all on the same side of the argument. So you ignore this and instead criticize ME. For these reasons I think a better word to use in connection with your actions is "hypocrisy." Perhaps I would add the adjective "blatant." Yes, I think "blatant hypocrisy" is the right term.

[Guest Esc_Tracker]

Fine, be hateful, spiteful and unpleasant (you appear to be unable to express dissagreement without reaching for these tools). I can't stop you, and it seems I and others cannot reach you on this issue (or any other, for that matter). If you believe in constructive criticism, it seems we are unable to offer you any.

 

I can deal with that. I can just pass over any post with your tag from now on without reading it. Since you seem to interpret all my appeals to you as personal attacks, perhaps you might be wise to do likewise.

 

In any case, the last word is yours if you want it (as you usually seem to).

 

Esc-Tracker

[Guest EvilSwine]

someone took their bitchy pills today.

[Guest jackson6]

>>But it seems that

>you also know the story

>as well........

>

Stephan, yes I do. For clarifation on the event, Billy was invited by Hooboy as a present for Daddy-in-Training, and that he could stay with him in his comped suite and if he wanted he could do a few in calls using the suite. Billy agreed and was excitied to meet Daddy-in-Training, since he is also very much into computers. He was going to do it as a favor to Hooboy. He paid his own airfare and scheduled only two calls, one in and one out.

 

When Billy arrived in Las Vegas he found out that things had changed and it was going to be a party not just Hooboy, Daddy-in-training and himself. I think you would have been unhappy also if you were told one thing and something else was taking place.

 

As far as Dinner at The Red Square, at Mandalay Bay, with everyone picking on him for his dinner choice and asking for ketcup to go with his steak and making fun of him for not liking fish, which the smell of makes him sick, an unpleasant attitude should be expected. With your French temper, I'm sure your attitude would not have been pleasant if this was happening to you.

 

And as you know with others to pick from Daddy-in-training made a different choice of escort that weekend. Had Billy known what the weekend was going to be he would not have gone, because it cost him money and time. Time he could have spent with other clients.

 

As far as Billy's hair piece and water you knew that it didn't bother it because you were in the water park with him at Mandalay Bay.

 

I know all this is true. I was with Billy when he and Hooboy talked on the phone to set the weekend up and over heard the conversation. Billy called me everyday from Las Vegas,and when he returned he showed me the pictures taken with his digital camera with Hooboy and Daddy blocked out.

[Guest regulation]

>Fine, be hateful, spiteful and unpleasant

>(you appear to be unable

>to express dissagreement without reaching

>for these tools). I

>can't stop you, and it

>seems I and others cannot

>reach you on this issue

>(or any other, for that

>matter). If you believe

>in constructive criticism, it seems

>we are unable to offer

>you any.

>

 

Please speak for yourself rather than for an unspecified "we."

 

And when you speak, try to be honest. "Constructive criticism" comes best from those who haven't themselves indulged in the behavior they wish to criticize. In the thread on asking clients to write reviews, you disparaged clients who might be so "sensitive" and "insecure" that they'd be troubled by such a request; in the "Thread Removal" thread you confessed to having hangups quite similar to those you had disparaged earlier. In this thread you first dump on another poster for being critical of HB, then proceed to dump on me for being negative toward other posters. My problem may be a lack of (or indifference to) tact. Yours is that you're a sanctimonious hypocrite.

[Guest Stephan-Lacoste]

I mostly agree about what you are saying….

Now the difference for me is that I was going to meet Daddy in Training and I haven't been told that Billy boy was going to be of the party. Daddy and I did set up the Rendez-vous much earlier that few weeks in advance. So this is must be a misunderstand of Billy who may be thought he was going to meet daddy for " Sex business" other than try to improve his skills in the computer business.

Now if Billy Boy was Hooboy's gift that week end, why didn't he talk seriously about it with Daddy who stayed more than a week end over there. I have spent in my memory only one night with Daddy. Now several days minus one night (mine) equal a certain number that is enough time for our friend Billyboy to react face to the situation and be definitely Daddy's gift.

But again, and i will never forget, and as you said, I usually loose my temper, well that night I did not and this is something rare and I won't forget. Billy Boy’s attitude was such a 10 years old kid wanted ketchup on his fries (won't say French fries, oups I did it) and that really turned out to be such a pain in the butt. I might remind you if you don't know about it, well someone else was in the party that night at the restaurant, someone really elegant and very very good friend of Hooboy. Daddy and I really did not think Billy Attitude was appropriated in that place and that time. As well as the Waiters....

Now think about it, May be daddy was going to get with Billy Boy (which I have no clue still today, I should ask him by the way) may be he was going to hire him or do whatever he wanted of his gift, but when you have someone, as escort that popular, that you did invited for some time in Vegas, reacting that way because he did not have ketchup on his friend, it gives you more time to think about it. We should have gone to Mc Donald’s.

 

Now about his hair problems and being scared of getting wet, I have done that comment about the first time I met Billy Boy. I have never said he hasn't taken any shower the second Time I have seen him. Because the second time, I did my best to be away of him and see him as less as possible. So I could not tell if he ever took a shower...

Of course I knew that his hairpiece was not a big deal, because he has definitely changed of attitude...., no to the best. More than a half-year later.....

 

Now about that one:

Had Billy

">Known what the weekend was

>going to be he would

>not have gone, because it

>cost him money and time.

> Time he could have

>spent with other clients. "

 

Well so if Billy boy got paid to come to Vegas, not very cheap ticket first of all and was going to be the gift of Daddy in training, well He got paid right? So he did not loose money correct? And more over he has done clients.... so there is something here I don't understand. Why will he complains to come to Vegas, get paid to do nothing and have everything for free at the mandaly way. Not forgetting about the special private pool he had access to everything...... So please don't tell me that he did loose business by coming to Vegas and that he lost time. I have seen him spending more that thousand dollars in few minutes in gambling....... And i was in the same table sir.

Excuses are made to be used my friend, and everyone, included myself use them. Some use them once a while in rare occasion , some others use them all the time

Have a good day.

 

Stephan Lacoste

1-310-739-7842

http://www.stephanlacoste.com

http://www.eboysvideo.com

[Guest jackson6]

>

>

 

>

>Well so if Billy boy got

>paid to come to Vegas,

>not very cheap ticket first

>of all and was going

>to be the gift of

>Daddy in training, well He

>got paid right?

>

 

No he was not being paid he was going to do it as a favor for Hooboy.