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major Microsoft fuckup


Tom Isern
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If you are running Windows Home Edition, DO NOT install the new Internet Explorer 7. The solution to the problems you will get is a 1-2 hour ordeal on the phone with a MS technician. There are major bugs in this new release and it is INCOMPATIBLE with MS Home Edition.

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What actual problems are you having, Tom?

 

I use IE7 (although admittedly not in ANY "home" version of Windows) and don't have problems. No major problems, anyway. A lot of minor stupidities, but no really glaring fuckups.

 

I really am curious.

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I'm using XP, home edition. Installed IE 7 today and what a mess--whole system hung after accounts password page. Spent 2 hours on the phone with Microsoft--the tech and I learned together that IE 7 and Windows home edition are apparently incompatible. There's not a lot of chatter on the web yet about this, but I expect it to come.

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Guest ncm2169

< I'm using XP, home edition.

 

Well, there ya go. Anyone who hails from Lake Wobegon ought to know to use XP Professional. }(

 

Sorry, Tom, I couldn't resist. I am sure it's been terribly frustrating.

 

Btw, how much does Microshit charge for their tech consulting?

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>Installed IE 7 today and what a

>mess--whole system hung after accounts password page.

 

Not an IE issue. IE does not handle system login. Has nothing to do with it.

 

>Spent 2

>hours on the phone with Microsoft--the tech and I learned

>together that IE 7 and Windows home edition are apparently

>incompatible.

 

Utterly bogus. Completely. There are too many "home" systems running IE7 to believe this for even a minute.

 

You had a bad tech. Maybe he was working with the vague information you've given here?

 

> There's not a lot of chatter on the web yet

>about this, but I expect it to come.

 

Don't hold your breath. You haven't stated your problem. Haven't said what you tried.

 

I hate to say this (because I really do like you) but this sounds like pilot error.

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Well, Deej, I'm a little troubled that you called my story here "uggerly bogus," because it implies more than that I had a "bad tech," but that I am somehow lying here.

 

I can assure you this was no "pilot error," and to ease your curiosity, I am cutting and pasting the e-mail from the MS tech I worked with. I had installed IE 7 that morning. Everything fell apart. The techie was able to fix things, and after cleaning up the mess he uninstalled IE 7, told me to not install it again, that it is incompatible with Windows Home Edition, and encouraged me to spread the word about the problem. The tech lingo will perhaps enlighten the situation. You can see from the report here that IE 7 is clearly identified as the cause of the problem. Here it is:

 

 

This is Viraj Barot with Microsoft Windows Technical Support.

It was my pleasure to work with you on your Windows service request 1055253688. I hope that you were happy with the service provided to you.

Based on our last conversation it appears that this service request is resolved and ready to be archived. If this is not correct or if you are not happy with the support we’ve provided please let us know as soon as possible. My goal is to ensure that your experience with Microsoft Windows Technical Support leaves you pleased with our products and services.

Here is a summary of the key points of the service request for your records:

ACTION :you were trying to work on the computer

RESULT :you were unable to work as keeps getting error for paging file and Windows - Corrupt File : The file or directory C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable. Please run the Chkdsk utility

CAUSE : internet explorer 7 secured features

RESOLUTION : removed Internet Explorer 7.

Dicription:

 

Action: restated the computer

Result: done

Action: open system properties change the paging file size to 1024-2048

Result: done

 

Action: restarted the computer

Result: done

Action: while trying to open IE

Result: we get blue screen error Windows corrupt file or directory please run chkdsk

 

Action: restarted the computer

Result: still get the error file for paging file size

Action: we get error Application popup: Windows - Corrupt File : The file or directory C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable. Please run the Chkdsk utility.

Result:done

Action: we have removed IE 7 completed

Result: done

Action: restarted the computer

Result:done

Action: did not get any error

Result: for virtual memory or Windows - Corrupt File : The file or directory C:\$Mft is corrupt and unreadable. Please run the Chkdsk utility.

Action: open run prefetch

Result: delete files

Action: open run temp

Result: delete files

Action: open run %temp%

Result: delete files

Action: we have registered all dll files

Result: done

 

Action: performed IE optimization

Result: done

Action: restarted the computer

Result: done

Action: able to open all programs without

Result: able to open successfully

Action: closing the case as resolved

Result: case closed

If you have any feedback regarding Microsoft support, we would be glad to hear from you. If you would feel more comfortable speaking with someone else regarding my service, Advaita solanki, my manager, would be very happy to hear your comments and suggestions. You may reach my manager by sending an email to v-2advas@mssupport.microsoft.com

Thank you for contacting Microsoft Windows Technical Support.

Sincerely,

Viraj Barot

v-2virab@mssupport.microsoft.com

0700-1600 PST

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>Hey NCM,

>Microsoft didn't charge me anything for this, I presume

>because it was their fault. You can bet if this had been

>"pilot error," as Deej implies, I would have been

>stuck with a whopping bill.

>

 

Tom,

 

I ran into problems such as yours with a PC I bought for my sister a few months ago. New machine, running XP Home edition. Over the holiday, I spent hours trying to get IE to work correctly by uninstalling/reinstalling, etc. She's not particular, so I downloaded netscape for her and gave up on IE. I'm glad you posted that its a Microsoft issue.

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Oooh!

 

(sorry I had to goad you into providing more details than "Microsoft fuckup" -- but that's exactly what it was ... a goad.)

 

Pagefile issues are *Windows* issues. They are not related to any individual application and they are often hardware-induced.

 

I suspect a bad cluster on your hard disk, and it just happened to be IE that found it. I see a chkdsk in there, which is a proper diagnostic/fix, if the right switches were used.

 

None of that minimizes the problem, of course.

 

But sorry, that tech needs a talking to. (And I'll try to see that he gets one.) You don't solve a software problem by removing the software. That's like repairing your car by not driving.

 

This is the kind of support case that a few of us love to rub MS' nose in and I'll add it to the collection. The priority clearly isn't "fix the problem". The priority is "close the issue".

 

I'll have fun with this one. Thanks!

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Deej,

 

I'm working on a brand new iMac, so if MS have obscured the "real" problem, what do you propose that I do? I'd hate to have this issue resurface under another guise.

 

I have to say I'm a little skeptical of your theory here. I've had enough experience with MS to know that if the problem had been in any way related to hardware they would have sent me packing to Apple (which they tried to do at first) or charged me a mountain to assist with the problem.

 

I appreciate your insight!

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Oh! I wish you'd mentioned it was an iMac before! It doesn't really change my opinion, but it's an *important* piece of the puzzle.

 

I still think you suffered a hardware issue, specifically a bad cluster(s) on your hard disk. It's a normal thing; all disks have them at some point in their lifetime. In normal operations, the OS knows how to walk around them.

 

You just happened to have a cluster failure in a critical area, the Windows page file. (Every OS has such a critical area, so this isn't unique to Windows.) The OS can't recover from a disk failure when the part of the disk that fails holds the part of the OS used for recovery.

 

It's the classic "I'm choking on a chicken bone but I can't tell you I'm choking on a chicken bone because I'm choking on a chicken bone" situation.

 

The computer maker does not matter. They all use the same disks from the same few manufacturers. Windows support was the right place to handle the situation because it's actually a common situation with ALL hard disks. It's just something to be worked through.

 

It sounds like chkdsk did its job and you're back up and running. You should be fine. Most people don't see this sort of failure because the software normally DOES recover better, but sometimes it can't. It just wasn't your day.

 

My gripe in your support case is that a Microsoft representative told you that Internet Explorer is incompatible with Windows. That's just plain bogus. I can hear Steve Ballmer shrieking (although, sadly, I doubt he'll ever hear of it -- which is part of the problem).

 

And all of this is just my current opinion because with every post you provide new details. ;-)

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Sorry for making you pull the details out of me, Deej. But you can now understand why I called it a "major" MS fuckup. I believed what the tech told me--that IE 7 and Windows Home Edition are incompatible.

 

Not sure if this matters at all, but I have my disc partitioned and I'm running Windows XP, not Mac OS, using Bootcamp. Also, the techie said that the problem, although it appeared at first to be a bad part of the hard drive, was actually IE 7. His theory was that the warning from chkdsk was a false alarm triggered by IE 7's enhanced security codes. In any case, the whole problem went away once we uninstalled IE 7. What does that tell you?

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>Sorry for making you pull the details out of me, Deej.

 

Welcome to the wonderful world of tech support. It's REALLY expensive to troubleshoot when you don't have details, and nobody ever provides details. Sometimes you have to insult people (as I did here) to get them to cough up the details needed to diagnose an issue.

 

(Again, sorry for that!)

 

>I believed what the tech told me--that IE 7 and

>Windows Home Edition are incompatible.

 

Does it help put it in perspective that you weren't dealing with a Microsoft employee? He works for a company contracted to provide tier one support. You can tell from his email address that you posted earlier.

 

>Not sure if this matters at all, but I have my disc

>partitioned and I'm running Windows XP, not Mac OS, using

>Bootcamp.

 

Yeah, it matters. But it still doesn't change my mind. ;-)

 

>Also, the techie said that the problem, although it

>appeared at first to be a bad part of the hard drive, was

>actually IE 7. His theory was that the warning from chkdsk

>was a false alarm triggered by IE 7's enhanced security codes.

> In any case, the whole problem went away once we uninstalled

>IE 7. What does that tell you?

 

It tells me his theory was he'd tell you anything that would get the case closed and get you off the phone. In the old days we'd blame static electricity and users would say "OK" and close the ticket.

 

His theory of chkdsk colliding with IE7 doesn't hold water because they're mutually exclusive. IE7 can't be running when chkdsk is running, and chkdsk can't be running when IE7 is running. They never co-exist.

 

I'm sorry, but if IE7 was really incompatible with XP/Home, millions of computers would be dead right now because they've been pushing out IE7 on Windows Update for a year or so. The story just doesn't hold water.

 

There is a scenario that might cause an issue. IE7 requires SP2 on Windows XP. If you're running XP without SP2 (and you're nuts if you are), you shouldn't install IE7. (It *should* refuse to install, but I can see that slipping through the cracks.)

 

You've been sold a pig in a poke, but at least your computer is working!

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Guest ncm2169

I'm definitely no techie, but I am surprised no one has suggested you ditch IE and switch to Mozilla Firefox, which I use exclusively (unless there is some specific application for which I must use IE).

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Install the IETAB Firefox addin and you'll probably never need IE again.

 

Just understand that with an IETAB site you actually *are* running IE, but you're running it inside Firefox.

 

(Yeah, it's weird ... but it lets you live within one browser from YOUR POV, even though you're really using both.)

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IETAB is a great addin!

 

I have a couple of sites I use regularly (credit cards) that require IE. With IETAB, I never have to leave Firefox except for the most egregious IE-based sites. It's the closest I've been to using one browser to surf the net in 10 years.

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I actually prefer Opera, but it lacks some of Firefox's fit-and-finish.

 

Firefox isn't the be-all and end-all some people make it out to be. If you turn your computer off every day, though, you'll never notice Firefox's severe memory leaks and eventual degradation of system performance.

 

Browser wars had a milestone in the last week or so. Netscape is no more. RIP

 

People come and go so *quickly* here, Toto!

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Guest ncm2169

OMG!! Now, Opera.

 

I can't keep up. .x(

 

Fuck, I still long for the days when Ma Bell was my only choice for a phone line. }(

 

And, for the record, old Ma took LOTS better care of me than either Qwest or Sprint!!!

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