Populist Fury

That short tweet triggered many of the worst people of this nation, from both sides of the political spectrum <3

I don't think it's absolutely necessary to have one, but it's always nice having the option to discuss various subjects, including politics. Especially these days when almost everything has become so ridiculously politicized.
 
Vast majority of message boards out there have their own Politics section, whether it's just a single thread, or an entire forum dedicated to the subject. Even the MMA/Wrestling/Boxing mega site I sometimes visit for results has it's own vibrant political section
 
 

 
Is there a way to make phone emojis show on the site after the update, or is that something you wouldn't be interested in enabling atm??????

I'm going to be hosting a vegan mexitalian feast for Thanksgiving this year... Got tired of having to deal with the vomit-inducing stench of turkey being baked @ other places, so I'll be spending all of tomorrow cooking & prepping for the next day. Never liked turkey meat back when I ate meat anyway... It was always about the mashed potatoes, stuffing, + homemade buns for me.

I don't think it's absolutely necessary to have one, but it's always nice having the option to discuss various subjects, including politics. Especially these days when almost everything has become so ridiculously politicized.
 
Vast majority of message boards out there have their own Politics section, whether it's just a single thread, or an entire forum dedicated to the subject. Even the MMA/Wrestling/Boxing mega site I sometimes visit for results has it's own vibrant political section
 
 

 
Is there a way to make phone emojis show on the site after the update, or is that something you wouldn't be interested in enabling atm??????

A Modest Proposal.....
 
The events which led to the shutdown of the politics forum were almost entirely the result of the compulsive and incessant posting behavior of one member and the reactions to it by others, which included a combination of attempts at friendly persuasion, harsh criticism which sometimes crossed over into personal attacks, ignoring said member, or departing the forums altogether. None of these responses had any effect whatsoever on this person. As others have pointed out, the problem was not confined to the politics forum, but extended to every forum where this member participated.
 
In the time I have been posting here there have been a number of instances of behavior which resulted in timeouts but none rose to the level of the current crisis. We all can probably think of a few posters with whom we sharply disagree and whose behavior we find to be annoying. I think the difference this time was the sheer volume of posts, mostly trivial, diversionary, and/or attention-seeking, which this member made.
 
My suggestion is to place a limit on the number of posts each member can make each day. I can tolerate annoying and/or disagreeable posts from anyone as long as they do not take over the entire forum. If there were a limit of, say 25 posts per member per day, that would force each of us to more carefully consider if what we are about to post contributes any real value or is just diversionary or repetitive. Whenever any discussion becomes dominated by one or a small group of posters it discourages others from participating and often devolves into behavior which devalues the forum for everyone.

There is one possible consideration I don’t believe has been raised. Let the PRW forum remain with the caveat that it is a free-for-all and only adults are allowed in the room. Can’t take the heat? Too damn bad, stay away.
 
The overarching rule would be; absolutely NO bleeding / overflow into other forums. Hurt feelings, bad personalities, Ill-will towards another based on PRW interaction ENDS THE MOMENT ONE CLICKS TO ANOTHER FORUM.
 
Honestly I see no way of conditioning behavior. Buttons, warnings, likes, dislikes...people are going to be who they are, do what they do when it comes to devisive issues.
 
Yes I like the PRW forum despite the heat and I wonder if it disappears many might express their energetic personalities in the other forums.

I don't think it's absolutely necessary to have one, but it's always nice having the option to discuss various subjects, including politics. Especially these days when almost everything has become so ridiculously politicized.
 
Vast majority of message boards out there have their own Politics section, whether it's just a single thread, or an entire forum dedicated to the subject. Even the MMA/Wrestling/Boxing mega site I sometimes visit for results has it's own vibrant political section
 
 

 
Is there a way to make phone emojis show on the site after the update, or is that something you wouldn't be interested in enabling atm??????

I don’t believe so. I know at least one person who has me on their buddy list (he’s shown me his list) but I don’t recall ever getting a notification that I had been added. I think it’s similar to “favoriting” someone on Grindr.

The one thing I absolutely love about Thanksgiving is that it is a totally nonsectarian U.S. America Holiday. It doesn't make a damn bit of difference if one is Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, etc. most of us go out get a turkey and prepare all the trimmings. I find the holiday very unifying. Just yesterday, while standing in line, in the grocery store I got into a discussion with a middle aged woman from Italy about how we make our dressings. We exchanged some ideas, wished each other Happy Thanksgiving and then went on our merry ways.

Scalloped potatoes
 
 

 
Homemade carrot cake
 

I pretty much agree with Cooper on this. I certainly think a big red warning sign is important but don't like the "by invitation only" or "dislike people out" approaches. I don't enjoy forums where everyone agrees on everything. Even intelligent posters with information to offer get tossed out and then it becomes a dogfight as to who's the most "pure" on the party line. Cheerleader tryouts.
 
Forums are moderated with the "report" button and it's the mod's decision as to what is personal attacks and what is just unliked opinions or information. Personally I don't really pay much attention to trolls who are looking for a fight or to lonely people looking for friends. Both usually have simple posts and little new information. But the ones who come just to make personal insults against posters are too much to deal with. They spread poison that really makes a forum reek. And they should probably not be spending a lot of time online, they should be learning how to deal with other people. You can't act like that in real life; only behind a keyboard.
 
But the worst offenders for personal insults are the most liked !!! Who can throw the worst insults not only against the other tribe but against members of "our" tribe who intelligently voice any non-conformity. "A" is lonely and brings up simple things to start conversations. I disagree with virtually 100% of his politics. But he's polite and I politely ignore him. But "K...y", who I probably agree with on 90% of stuff, sometimes has useful information but his main purpose on the board is to hurl the most vile personal insults ad hominem directly at other people every day. I've never seen a board that tolerates repeated blasts of "pig", "moron", "stupid", "shut-up!", etc the way he gets away with every day. And it's probably because none of us hit the "report" button to get a mod to review those vile insults. Not only that but "K...y" has one of the highest number of "likes" on the board. Posters want a bloodly fight.
 
One of the things that made America great is our pragmatism. Free speech and democracy helped us try different things to see what worked. We didn't only tolerate one ideology. If an idea is bad it's going to fail when tried. But free speech is critical to come up with new ideas to try.

The old adage, "You're damned if you do and you're damned if you don't" best describes how I feel about moderating this site. We can't please all but like you, I, too, want to see the PR&W Forum up and running so that all members feel comfortable in posting their positions in a civil way regardless of their political persuasion.
 
The PR&W Forum is a challenge to moderate. The majority of reports we receive deal with personal attacks. The rules are very clear about the actions moderators can take on this issue. They read: "Attacks against members will only be acted upon at the request of the member being attacked. If you submit a report because you see a violation of that rule keep in mind that the report must be submitted by the "member being attacked". Most members do not submit reports/alerts making it appear that the moderators aren't taking action or following the rules. Not so! But maybe it's time for us to revisit that rule if it helps getting the Forum back up and running.
 
The Moderators do not discuss on the Message Board alerts received or actions taken. We also do not mention the names of members who are banned or timed out. We respect your privacy. If you want to crack down on personal attacks help us out and submit those reports.
 
Are new Guidelines and new rules necessary to get this Forum back? Or are the current Terms and Rules sufficient? Perhaps following them is the best answer.
 
Cooper

Posting off-topic is muddying the water and delaying a possible return of the PR&W forum.
 
One of things I've noted while looking at the next version of Xenforo is that the Warning system was improved. I suspect that we'll be using it more and it can trigger temporary or permeant bans. BTW: Lots of goodies to share all around.

I think the "report" is good enough to have a mod take a look. Together with the big red warning notice.
 
Many people have trouble entertaining different viewpoints. But practice in a forum like Politics is invaluable in learning how to do so. It's an important tool in life.
 
Personally since I champion the poor, I'm used to dealing with narrow-minded and unsophisticated poor people. I try not to openly disagree but try to find out why they feel that way, seeming to agree. Then I turn their concern into a progressive issue. 9/10 of the time it works. "Deplorables" are people with many legitimate problems and concerns. And when it doesn't seem to work I politely say something like "I think we're on the same page what the problem is so please think about my solution".
 
Anger converts no one. Ever.

Hmm. Let me guess.
 
Are you Trevor Noah in disguise?
 
I don't agree with the idea that politics is not personal and serious. But I do agree that treating it the way Noah does - with humor and as a sense of incredulity when you run into a real Bozo - is a good strategy. And Noah talks about how he differs from Jon Stewart and his approach is intentionally age-centric - meaning oriented to a highly educated younger audience that is capable of showing humility and humor.

If gay men didn't salivate over the 'straight/str8' fantasy, this kind of horse shit wouldn't happen as much. I'm all for spending your gay money supporting gay escorts.
 
Chase the dream all you want. Just don't act shocked when they tell you that you disgust them.

And this is what you get when you so badly want the “trade” fantasy.

I'm cool with w/e works. People just need to stop taking politics so personally & seriously. Nothing said on a message board like this one is going to actually change or influence any of what happens out there in the real world. Social media is a far more effective venue for that kind of political activism.
 
I post @ another board where the average age is like mid 20's to 30, vast majority under 40 (we had a board census back June <3), & we all get along just fine even after vicious fights over politics break out in the one thread dedicated to the subject. Whatever happens in there, stays in there, & we don't drag any of the political drama out into other areas of the board. We also deal with the resident trolls there with humor, & that's always more effective than allowing them to trigger us with their posts. I actually dig a couple of them lol

I'm cool with w/e works. People just need to stop taking politics so personally & seriously. Nothing said on a message board like this one is going to actually change or influence any of what happens out there in the real world. Social media is a far more effective venue for that kind of political activism.
 
I post @ another board where the average age is like mid 20's to 30, vast majority under 40 (we had a board census back June <3), & we all get along just fine even after vicious fights over politics break out in the one thread dedicated to the subject. Whatever happens in there, stays in there, & we don't drag any of the political drama out into other areas of the board. We also deal with the resident trolls there with humor, & that's always more effective than allowing them to trigger us with their posts. I actually dig a couple of them lol

The IGNORE button is the finest invention for all forums.
 
If you aren't reading the offensive post about you, you won't feel no need to flame the ignorant poster.

If you have "dislike" buttons you are simply going to have people with a different viewpoint from the majority kicked out. Echo chambers are comforting but not interesting or educational. But yes, keeping politics out of the rest of the site is invaluable.

Another important point: "No Name Calling." We're not going to bully other people by denigrating them.

Maybe just a big red warning at the top of the page to be civil and not attack another poster ever, only their argument.
 
There are only 15 or 20 people in that forum but it's the most combative I've ever seen. I've done my share of what I considered defensive attacks but that's no excuse for me getting mad. Even being on the left you get attacked for any deviation from DNC platform or CNN talking points. Intruders from the right are really roasted.
 
I don't care what opinion someone has. I care what information or viewpoint they can share. I'm used to having to find the best argument for both sides, to being a devil's advocate sometimes, and to having conversations like "but what about the argument that....". Some posters present simplistic mantras conservative or liberal but I ignore them. What's the purpose getting worked up over a simplistic parroted line? You won't gain any new perspective arguing with them over a simplistic line they're repeating. It's like arguing with the stenographer in a courtroom.
 

The Politics, Religion & War Issues" forum was created because comments on those topics were cluttering up the Lounge, and it was considered a good idea to segregate them in a place where members who were not interested did not have to encounter them, and where members who were interested in using the MB only to discuss those topics could congregate. There is at least one forum in the current site that is open only to those who meet a certain requirement. Why not impose some kind of restriction on those who are allowed to post in the PR&WI forum? Perhaps they could be required to pay a membership fee for the PR&WI forum, and could be expelled if the moderator of the forum felt they were abusing their privileges ("You have insufficient privileges to post here" is already available for use). Paying even a nominal amount does tend to make one appreciate one's privileges more. Although I sympathize with the administrators' exasperation at dealing with some of the nastiness and childishness that takes place in that forum, I agree with Steven K. that simply banning discussion of topics that mean a great deal to many of us--especially those of us who have fought as gay men for the right to talk about those subjects in public--seems unrealistic in a site designed for gay men to talk in private. In one form or another, those subjects will find their way back into the Lounge, and we will be back where we started from.

Someone said: "Big Red Letters" at the top of the forum. We've done this before and it worked well. "Escort Travels" comes to mind.
 
So let's work on that short, simple manifesto.
 
For me the important point is centuries old: "Attack the message not the messenger."