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Ian Thorpe comes out!

marylander1940

By marylander1940
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With all due respect to Ian, he doesn't know everyone's life. Coming out may be a good thing- or for some depending on their situation a hell, and I am sure there are many gradations between. Coming out is not a panacea. It probably has both good and bad ripples. Who is to say that in some cases the bad outnumber the good.

 

I don't think he said he knows everyone's life. What he said is that he's never met someone who came out and regretted it, and that he feels sorry for closet-cases. Obviously, any gay person living in Uganda would risk his life by coming out. If I lived in a country where being gay meant risking death (Uganda, Iran, Saudi Arabia, for example), my life's goal would be to be able to leave the country to another where I could get political asylum. That's what my domestic partner did (he used to be Russian). And, like Sir Ian, I feel very sorry for any gay person in such a situation who really can't come out. I would help any that I could. But Australia's hardly Saudi Arabia or Uganda.

Guest

Guest

Posted
Posted

Whom I have sex with is no one's business but mine and my fuckee...

 

True. It's perfectly appropriate to say "That's not something I care to discuss." If you lie about it, though, you'r a liar.

 

http://www.dnamagazine.com.au/media/0/25851/2/Editor112v01.jpg

Steven_Draker Mentor

Steven_Draker

Posted
Posted
Well said Sir Gman...I concur.

 

It takes balls to come out ...

 

Of course it would be nice if everyone was able to come out to the people they love the most, if they were accepting and supportive that is.

 

It gets better with new generations ... it gets better.

Gar1eth Grand Master

+ Gar1eth

Posted
Posted
With all due respect to Ian, he doesn't know everyone's life. Coming out may be a good thing- or for some depending on their situation a hell, and I am sure there are many gradations between. Coming out is not a panacea. It probably has both good and bad ripples. Who is to say that in some cases the bad outnumber the good.

 

Gman

 

I don't think he said he knows everyone's life. What he said is that he's never met someone who came out and regretted it, and that he feels sorry for closet-cases. [/Quote]

 

But this is exactly what I mean. We want to hope that coming out makes people feel better. But what if it drives important people away from your life? And yes you can say that 'those people' who can't accept you being gay are not people you want in your life anyway. But unfortunately life isn't so black and white. Those still may be people you care about. Or we don't even have to go to Uganda. Here in the good old US of A- there are multiple states (possibly a majority of them) where if you don't have a federal/enlightened city/state job, you could be fired for being gay. You could also lose where you live. We mythologize 'coming out' as if it's going to solve the majority of everyone's problems. That people scared and hiding in shadows will suddenly come 'into the light' of gay solidarity and support. And I'm sure in some cases that's true. But the 'mythology' that everything is/will be coming up roses after coming out makes it even worse for the people whose coming out does not turn out that way. I'll repeat - there is no guarantee that coming out will be a panacea. For those it is- they should be supremely thankful.

 

Gman

marylander1940 Grand Master

marylander1940

Posted
  • Author
Posted
With all due respect to Ian, he doesn't know everyone's life. Coming out may be a good thing- or for some depending on their situation a hell, and I am sure there are many gradations between. Coming out is not a panacea. It probably has both good and bad ripples. Who is to say that in some cases the bad outnumber the good.

 

Gman

 

I never thought this thread I opened about this swimmer's coming out would take this turn.

 

I must a agree with you and disagree with Sir Ian.

 

http://izquotes.com/quotes-pictures/quote-i-am-i-plus-my-circumstances-jose-ortega-y-gasset-69015.jpg

Guest

Guest

Posted
Posted
Who isn't a liar?

 

I definitely have my faults, but being a liar isn't one of them. And I certainly don't try to make a living selling a lying autobiography.

Guest

Guest

Posted
Posted
there is no guarantee that coming out will be a panacea.

 

I can't imagine anyone would be so stupid as to think that coming out will be a panacea. But when you live a lie, you lose self-respect and your dignity. It will be interesting to see what happens, but I suspect that Thorpe will be much happier. Maybe he'll even write a truthful book about his time in the closet and coming out. That would be a book I would be more interested to read (I have read with interest a number of those books, including those written by some other Olympic gold medalists such as Greg Louganis and Canadian Olympic gold medalist Mark Tewksbury).

Bargara Leatherboy Mentor

Bargara Leatherboy

Posted
Posted

Unicorn, I hear what you are saying about truth.

 

The only thing I want to comment on is that Ian Thorpe was encouraged by his mentors in Swimming Australia to stay in the closet.

 

It is important to understand that a young sports person is dependent on the political leaders in their chosen sport, for support and guidance. The politics of sport as such that if he came out as gay, when he was certainly not accepting of who he was, Ian Thorpe would have missed out of swimming opportunities and as sad and maybe as wrong as this is, sponsorship opportunities. Ian Thorpe has made a lot of money out of sport and his brand.

 

Matthew Mitcham, has traveled a different journey, different head space, a few years younger, and while he is certainly rewarded, he does not have the sponsorship that straight athletes have, as many companies do not want to piss off the haters out there for financial reasons.

 

I am not saying that this choice is the right one, I am just saying its the way it currently is. Yes it will get better, and apart from lots in the gay community saying whats some have said on here, Ian Thorpe has had a pretty postiive reaction to this news.

 

When I say that he is a deep thinking and a beautiful person I am talking about his intelligence and intellect, he is a University Graduate, well read, well studied, a thoughtful and well researched commentator, and he has a great deal of inner beauty. I am not even going to mention his physical beauty.

 

Non of us are perfect, and as a group we are only as strong as our weakest member, we have all made mistakes along the way, and hindsight is the best vision, if only we could see where our decisions would take us when we make them

Gar1eth Grand Master

+ Gar1eth

Posted
Posted
Unicorn, I hear what you are saying about truth.

 

The only thing I want to comment on is that Ian Thorpe was encouraged by his mentors in Swimming Australia to stay in the closet.

 

It is important to understand that a young sports person is dependent on the political leaders in their chosen sport, for support and guidance. The politics of sport as such that if he came out as gay, when he was certainly not accepting of who he was, Ian Thorpe would have missed out of swimming opportunities and as sad and maybe as wrong as this is, sponsorship opportunities. Ian Thorpe has made a lot of money out of sport and his brand.

 

Matthew Mitcham, has traveled a different journey, different head space, a few years younger, and while he is certainly rewarded, he does not have the sponsorship that straight athletes have, as many companies do not want to piss off the haters out there for financial reasons.

 

I am not saying that this choice is the right one, I am just saying its the way it currently is. Yes it will get better, and apart from lots in the gay community saying whats some have said on here, Ian Thorpe has had a pretty postiive reaction to this news.

 

When I say that he is a deep thinking and a beautiful person I am talking about his intelligence and intellect, he is a University Graduate, well read, well studied, a thoughtful and well researched commentator, and he has a great deal of inner beauty. I am not even going to mention his physical beauty.

 

Non of us are perfect, and as a group we are only as strong as our weakest member, we have all made mistakes along the way, and hindsight is the best vision, if only we could see where our decisions would take us when we make them

 

+1000

 

Gman

bigvalboy Grand Master

bigvalboy

Posted
Posted
Unicorn, I hear what you are saying about truth.

 

The only thing I want to comment on is that Ian Thorpe was encouraged by his mentors in Swimming Australia to stay in the closet.

 

It is important to understand that a young sports person is dependent on the political leaders in their chosen sport, for support and guidance. The politics of sport as such that if he came out as gay, when he was certainly not accepting of who he was, Ian Thorpe would have missed out of swimming opportunities and as sad and maybe as wrong as this is, sponsorship opportunities. Ian Thorpe has made a lot of money out of sport and his brand.

 

Matthew Mitcham, has traveled a different journey, different head space, a few years younger, and while he is certainly rewarded, he does not have the sponsorship that straight athletes have, as many companies do not want to piss off the haters out there for financial reasons.

 

I am not saying that this choice is the right one, I am just saying its the way it currently is. Yes it will get better, and apart from lots in the gay community saying whats some have said on here, Ian Thorpe has had a pretty postiive reaction to this news.

 

When I say that he is a deep thinking and a beautiful person I am talking about his intelligence and intellect, he is a University Graduate, well read, well studied, a thoughtful and well researched commentator, and he has a great deal of inner beauty. I am not even going to mention his physical beauty.

 

Non of us are perfect, and as a group we are only as strong as our weakest member, we have all made mistakes along the way, and hindsight is the best vision, if only we could see where our decisions would take us when we make them

 

Thank you for the additional information. You make some interesting points, that I wish others would take a moment to think about. None of us knows how a young persons life could have been impacted by coming out when they weren't ready, or how many young lives have been cut short by suicide, when someone outed them when he or she was not ready. Too many young gay men and women struggle with this very difficult issue, hell I think it is safe to say, that there are men and women of all ages in our community, who struggle or feel pressure from society almost daily. I have friends who are well into their senior years who have not come out to some of their friends, colleagues, or families, and they live happy, content, and full lives, and are at peace with their personal decisions. "Each to his own"

Steven_Draker Mentor

Steven_Draker

Posted
Posted
I have friends who are well into their senior years who have not come out to some of their friends, colleagues, or families, and they live happy, content, and full lives, and are at peace with their personal decisions.

 

It IS a personal choice and decision and it shouldn't be forced.

 

But I seriously doubt that living with a secret and not being out to the people you love the most would lead to a happy, content and fulfilling life. You can't live happily with that big of a secret.

 

Fortunately, the World is changing and future generations won't have to struggle with the stigma and discrimination older generations had to deal with.

 

[video=youtube;8TJxnYgP6D8]

bigvalboy Grand Master

bigvalboy

Posted
Posted

Given your life's experiences, it's your opinion, that's what you believe, and that's fine, but it's not the definitive one. You can't possibly know that to be true in all situations.

TruHart1 Grand Master

TruHart1

Posted
Posted
It IS a personal choice and decision and it shouldn't be forced.

 

But I seriously doubt that living with a secret and not being out to the people you love the most would lead to a happy, content and fulfilling life. You can't live happily with that big of a secret.

 

Fortunately, the World is changing and future generations won't have to struggle with the stigma and discrimination older generations had to deal with.

 

[video=youtube;8TJxnYgP6D8]

[/color]

 

Although there's always that 5 year old who can't get his head around it, this video seems to show things are changing for the better in our society! Thanks for this uplifting video, Steven.

 

TruHart1 :cool:

Becket Veteran

Becket

Posted
Posted

Each of our coming out Journeys is different. One is neither right or wrong. Some are in fact, more difficult to accomplish than others. I really am quite sick of people cursing and screaming when someone's story varies from whatever they believe is the "right" way to do it. Kicking anyone down because he "lied about his sexuality" minimizes pain and suffering we know nothing about. How dare we! This shit is difficult. It affects us emotionally, financially, and personally. And we have to weigh the pain we will be causing other people. So let's give Ian, and others out there who still struggle with "if and when" to come out, a big hug. He doesn't need a kick in the pants.

 

Gawd, the arrogance........

bigvalboy Grand Master

bigvalboy

Posted
Posted
Each of our coming out Journeys is different. One is neither right or wrong. Some are in fact, more difficult to accomplish than others. I really am quite sick of people cursing and screaming when someone's story varies from whatever they believe is the "right" way to do it. Kicking anyone down because he "lied about his sexuality" minimizes pain and suffering we know nothing about. How dare we! This shit is difficult. It affects us emotionally, financially, and personally. And we have to weigh the pain we will be causing other people. So let's give Ian, and others out there who still struggle with "if and when" to come out, a big hug. He doesn't need a kick in the pants.

 

Gawd, the arrogance........

 

+1....Well said Becket.

Diverdan Community Regular

Diverdan

Posted
Posted

Thanks so much for your comments, Becket... I have recently had a professional colleague come out to me, after many years of working together. I never, ever suspected his sexual orientation. He told me that coming out to me was something he had dreaded for a long time, although he said he knew it would not make any difference to our friendship. He has yet to come out to his parents, and he is an only child, so is dealing with the "why don't you get married and give us some grandchildren" message every time he sees them. I would give Ian a big HUG if I had the chance and tell him how pround I am of what he has done and the impact it will have on hundreds of boys in Australia and around the world.

Steven_Draker Mentor

Steven_Draker

Posted
Posted
So let's give Ian, and others out there who still struggle with "if and when" to come out, a big hug.

 

I do like and welcome warmly your idea !

 

http://mightyinspiration.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/bear-hug.jpg

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