Depression...

[+ newatthis]

...So where do I want to go from here if I've still decided to be in the closet?...So I decided that I need to broaden my horizons and try to be with a guy. I really haven't done much with a guy (I have zero interest in anal and practically none in oral). That leads me to what do I really want? A hot perfect guy who I can cuddle with and talk to, maybe one who will teach me how to kiss a guy...

f'timer -- you don't need "perfect" right now. You need a way to learn to feel comfortable in erotic situations with guys, in a way that is less stressful for you than hiring an escort. One possiblity is to find a good erotic masseur. Feeling another guy's touch on your body in a leisurely, unhurried way can do wonders. And it need not be expensive, either.

 

One more thing. Your choices at this point (no matter what others are telling you) are not limited to being lonely or coming out. As you progress in this journey, you may want the greater freedom that being out ultimately gives you, but it certainly doesn't have to be the initial step to ending your loneliness.

[firsttimer]

One more thing. Your choices at this point (no matter what others are telling you) are not limited to being lonely or coming out. As you progress in this journey, you may want the greater freedom that being out ultimately gives you, but it certainly doesn't have to be the initial step to ending your loneliness.

 

Thanks for saying that. I think that almost always when my story is told my psychologists/counselors say the first solution is to come out as if it were some easy solution to everything. Coming out is a huge process and will bring about multiple new problems and stresses in life added on to some of the stresses that may be solved. Currently those stresses that come about with coming out outweight the ones of staying depressed in my current condition.

[firsttimer]

FT,

 

It's great that you had a chance to meet with someone and talk face to face.

 

 

I know you guys are so supportive and I'm lucky to have had this opportunity.

 

is it ever right for anyone to ask anyone else to live an unhappy life?

 

The simple answer to your question is no. It is notright for anyone to ask someone else to live an unhappy life. But sometimes there isn't an easy way out of the unhappy life so you try to learn ways to make life a little more happier instead of everything being unhappy all the time and in all aspects of life. I think I am choosing now to try to see what it's like being with a guy and if that part of my life can be happier. I know, not the solution, but maybe a step in the right direction?

[Boston Guy]

I'm back but with limited time so my treatises will be shorter (much to everyone's immense relief!).

 

I've got two simple questions for you.

 

First, there's a man on a treadmill that's suspended about 24" above the floor. The treadmill is moving fast enough that he is running. At the end of the treadmill is a deep pit. Because it's moving quickly, he's afraid that if he jumps off, he's going to be injured. But he's getting tired. What do you tell him to do?

 

Second, there's a man who is having trouble at work. He's always coming in late and his boss is getting angry. He knows why his boss is peeved. He also knows why he is late all of the time and it's something that he could alter if he wanted but he's not yet ready to do that. Instead he decides that he's going to buy some new clothes and start dressing better for work. He asks you for your advice. What do you tell him to do?

 

 

BG

[Boston Guy]

One more thing. Your choices at this point (no matter what others are telling you) are not limited to being lonely or coming out. As you progress in this journey, you may want the greater freedom that being out ultimately gives you, but it certainly doesn't have to be the initial step to ending your loneliness.

 

I couldn't agree more.

 

FT has far more choices available to him than he yet realizes. Discovering the many different paths to happiness that are open to him will be a very important step on his journey away from loneliness and toward greater contentment.

 

BG

[Lookin]

Firsttimer, I'm one of those old-fashioned boys who stayed in the closet until I had a reason to come out. I was 28, in fact, and had just fallen in love. Those who were important in my life needed to hear the good news, and continue to share in my life. I'd been having sex with guys for a long time before that, but my sexual activities were only one part of who I was as a person, and they didn't define who I was. And, in the mid-twentieth century, most folks didn't go around talking about who they boinked last night and how many times and in what positions. If I had been an out gay man in the sixties, I wouldn't have been able to join the Peace Corps, and I'd have missed a couple of the best years of my life. I stayed pretty much celibate while I was out of the U. S., and still had a wonderful experience. Hard to believe, I'm sure, but there it is.

 

So I think you're right in dealing with your depression as just one part of the larger picture of who you are as a person and what makes you happy or unhappy. I'm surprised that some of the professionals you consulted zeroed in on just your sexual desires, and recommended coming out as the solution to all your problems. Did they have any other advice?

 

I hope you'll continue to look for a therapist who will consider all the factors in your life that might be contributing to your depression. You seem to have some pretty major external factors that are weighing you down. It might take a while to figure out what they are, and why they are exerting so much pressure on you. But it's probably a good idea to keep chipping away at it. The answer's out there, and you've taken the first major step by asking the question. Best of all, you're asking lots of people in lots of ways. You just never know when, or how, your answer will appear.

[firsttimer]

First thanks again to TBinChi who was nice enough to meet me in person today. And greatness even though he's sick still sending me his advice as jackcali as usual even if only in private.

 

I'm back but with limited time so my treatises will be shorter (much to everyone's immense relief!).

 

I've got two simple questions for you.

 

First, there's a man on a treadmill that's suspended about 24" above the floor. The treadmill is moving fast enough that he is running. At the end of the treadmill is a deep pit. Because it's moving quickly, he's afraid that if he jumps off, he's going to be injured. But he's getting tired. What do you tell him to do?

 

Second, there's a man who is having trouble at work. He's always coming in late and his boss is getting angry. He knows why his boss is peeved. He also knows why he is late all of the time and it's something that he could alter if he wanted but he's not yet ready to do that. Instead he decides that he's going to buy some new clothes and start dressing better for work. He asks you for your advice. What do you tell him to do?

 

 

BG

 

Tough questions BG, I continue to answer in public and share as to help others like you said who might be going through something similar.

 

I would tell the first guy to slow down the treadmill. Or tell him to look for the buttons on there like an emergency stop. Or he could call out to someone else on another treadmill or lifting weight and tell them to help you out by unplugging the treadmill. I guess you could also tell him to say his prayers and take the plunge?

 

The second guy needs to get to work on time because that is his job he is risking on the line. Getting nicer clothes doesn't solve his real problem. Why is he late though? Is it because he has five children, is a single parent, and after dropping them off to their various schools has to drive through morning traffic? If that's the case, then I'd feel sorry for him because he's not late because he chooses to be late. I wouldn't want him to dump the kids off at a foster home and use the money to buy an apartment blocks from his work so he could get there on time.

[Boston Guy]

Tough questions BG, I continue to answer in public and share as to help others like you said who might be going through something similar.

 

Not as tough as they might seem at first. Why? Because we look at them with two advantages over the poor guys in the hypothetical situation:

 

1. We see them from the outside. Problems are often much more easily seen from the outside. Have you even been in a situation where you were using a computer and others were watching what you were doing? It's often true that the other people who are watching can catch mistakes before the person at the keyboard. Distance helps a lot.

 

2. We can see the problems with emotional detachment. Sure, we can feel bad for the two poor guys but it's not like it's our bacon about to fall in the pit or get fired. Emotional proximity makes it harder to discern the real nature of the a problem and the real magnitude -- and also the range of possible solutions.

 

This exactly why businesses will often hire consultants to come in and offer advice. It isn't that the consultants are so much smarter than the existing employees or understand the problems more deeply. In fact, often, the consultants don't understand the problem at all at the beginning and need to rely on the employees for help in understanding. Instead, what the consultants can bring to a situation is an outside point of view and emotional detachment. Those two things can be terribly important. It's what therapists bring, too.

 

I would tell the first guy to slow down the treadmill. Or tell him to look for the buttons on there like an emergency stop. Or he could call out to someone else on another treadmill or lifting weight and tell them to help you out by unplugging the treadmill. I guess you could also tell him to say his prayers and take the plunge?

 

All good options, even the last one. Note what you didn't suggest: stop running and fall in the pit. Why didn't you suggest that one? It's a valid option.

 

Most likely, you correctly and quickly saw that falling in the pit was the greatest danger. This poor guy was repeating behavior over and over and if he kept on doing it eventually he'd be so exhausted that he'd face a great danger -- falling in the pit.

 

Instead, you came up with some clever suggestions: look for a power button; call for help; try to turn off the power. In the end, you even suggested that he say his prayers and take the plunge. I think your analysis of the situation and your suggestions are spot on.

 

If we changed it and said that the treadmill was suspended 30' in the air, well, we'd all look at it a little differently. But, at 24", those of us on the outside can see that, sure, he might get a little banged up if he jumps off. Maybe he'll even break a leg or something. But he's not going to die by falling into a deep pit.

 

The analogy to ourselves is clear and it's clear that you saw that. We all run on various treadmills and we repeat behavior that we know isn't healthy for us and isn't making us happy. Sometimes the consequences aren't so bad but sometimes they're pretty bad. Smoking cigarettes is a treadmill. Overeating to the point where you gain an extra 100 lbs or more is a treadmill. There are all kinds of treadmills and they all have two things in common: we keep running on them even when we know we shouldn't and they all end up leading sooner or later to a place where we know that we're going to be unhappy.

 

The second guy needs to get to work on time because that is his job he is risking on the line. Getting nicer clothes doesn't solve his real problem. Why is he late though? Is it because he has five children, is a single parent, and after dropping them off to their various schools has to drive through morning traffic? If that's the case, then I'd feel sorry for him because he's not late because he chooses to be late. I wouldn't want him to dump the kids off at a foster home and use the money to buy an apartment blocks from his work so he could get there on time.

 

Exactly right. His proposed solution won't do him any good because he's not solving the real problem. There may be many reasons why he is always late but he needs to make a decision: either start showing up on time or find another job.

 

Either of those decisions might be the right one for this guy. The only real wrong decision is the one that he has settled on: buying new clothes. That might be a feel-good course of action but it isn't going to help him. He's got to analyze his life and decide if he can get to work on time or go out and find a job that he can fulfill in a satisfactory way.

 

This one is also clear: when we're trying to solve a problem, we often try to fix things by reaching out and taking a course of action that feels good but won't solve anything. The only real way to solve a problem is identify the cause and either fix the things that are causing the problem or take some other kind of action to eliminate the problem in a different way. Feel-good quick fixes don't work.

 

Some people will jump on "geographic solutions": "It's not working for me in Boston, all these people are jerks. I'm going to go to LA where I'll be more successful." But geographic solutions are often just an expensive form of feel-good solutions. The people get to the new location and then act the same way they did in the old one and all of their problems come back.

 

I sense that you're growing tired of the questions and the analogies. I'll offer some specific advice in my next post.

[Romann]

Turn that frown upside down and remember, you're never alone in this world and we're all your resource for finding the happiness that you're seeking.

[firsttimer]

I sense that you're growing tired of the questions and the analogies. I'll offer some specific advice in my next post.

 

Lol. You can ask whatever you want (well maybe not my real name lol). I agree with the analogies you are trying to make. It is easier to look at things from an outsider's perspective instead of being in the hotseat yourself. And I did think of the solution of just giving up and falling into the pit, but I'm assuming that you wanted all the other possibilities other than that one as that's the obvious =). And I am the tired person on the treadmill running, so I called out to asked for your help. That was my solution.

 

And you're right in sensing that some feel good solutions is also what I'm looking for which will not solve the problem in the first place. Hiring the perfect A&F model escort of my dreams will not solve the problem that I am having these thoughts and feelings. After my one hour 500 dollar meeting, I will soon be back in the same situation, 500 dollars in debt, and even more depressed that this dream guy isn't mine lol.

 

I've got to go cook dinner now. As always I appreciate everyone's support. Jackcali already said he can hear a little more hope in me today than yesterday which I can only attribute to those from the board who have met with me, sent me emails, given me their phone numbers, and offered their advice on the thread.

[Guest RyanCade]

Get Out Of Yourself And Into Others

 

What do you all do to cheer yourself up when you're feeling down about life?

 

Usually when I feel bad, it's because I am feeling sorry for myself and failing to be grateful for the many blessings in my life. in other words I am not getting something I want, think I deserve, This is an indicatiion of low self esteem and/or self centered thinking.. So the cure is get out of self and into others

 

I find taking a ride on public transportation always gives me some gratitude. It makes me see how much I really have that a lot of people don't.

 

It also helps to go through your list of friends amd think of ways you can make their day better and then do it.. even just calling them saying Hi I just wanted to let you know I am glad you are in my life, imagine how you would feel to get that call....

 

start foccussing on what you can do to contribute and enhance another humans life. Do you know anybody that is going through a hard time? call them say what can I do to help?

 

You will forget about what it is thats got you down and that much happiness can be found in helping others.. You will always get more than you give and you will always smile more when you look in the mirror and the truth is Self Esteem is the bi product of esteem-able acts....

 

Hugs I hope you feel better...

[firsttimer]

What do you all do to cheer yourself up when you're feeling down about life?

 

Usually when I feel bad, it's because I am feeling sorry for myself and failing to be grateful for the many blessings in my life. in other words I am not getting something I want, think I deserve, This is an indicatiion of low self esteem and/or self centered thinking.. So the cure is get out of self and into others

 

I find taking a ride on public transportation always gives me some gratitude. It makes me see how much I really have that a lot of people don't.

 

It also helps to go through your list of friends amd think of ways you can make their day better and then do it.. even just calling them saying Hi I just wanted to let you know I am glad you are in my life, imagine how you would feel to get that call....

 

start foccussing on what you can do to contribute and enhance another humans life. Do you know anybody that is going through a hard time? call them say what can I do to help?

 

You will forget about what it is thats got you down and that much happiness can be found in helping others.. You will always get more than you give and you will always smile more when you look in the mirror and the truth is Self Esteem is the bi product of esteem-able acts....

 

Hugs I hope you feel better...

 

I definitely am ungrateful for all the things I have in my life. My family, my health, my friends, a warm roof over my head, and a computer with Internet so I can talk to you all! =)

 

It's hard though when you're in this state to think like that. The only way that thought even crossed my mind is because of the reminders from you all that there is more to life than what I'm depressed about and that I need to focus on the good parts. So thanks for reminding me again as it does make a difference to see those suffering around us and think about so much more than we have.

 

I also agree with the selfless acts part too. I don't want to sound boastful as I am a humble person, but usually it's my friends and family that ask me to cheer them up when they are down. I have spent much of my life helping others, even strangers. Yet part of my depression yesterday was that all those friends and family weren't there to help me when I'm feeling at the bottom of the depth of depression. I tried to reach out to them and got nothing back. As I mentioned before, it got to the point where I was so desperate I called glutes, who gave me his cellphone, who is a stranger I met from this board even knowing that he would be out with his friends and must have thought I was some crazied person for calling him. I was so saddened realizing that in my time of need, I had to go to a stranger after everything I've given to others all the other times. So that's a little bit more insight into part of the loneliness yesterday. If I had gone out and helped someone or called another friend to help them, it'd only make me pity my pathetic self more.

[Guest RyanCade]

it'd only make me pity my pathetic self more.

 

The trick to giving is that you cannot expect anything in return. Being altruistic is what makes it magic...

 

The way you talk to yourself has a larger impact than the way others talk to to you... So be careful about saying things like "my pathetic self" from what you said you have helped others and what they do with it is their buisiness. You do your part ansd the rest is out of your hands.

 

Remember this too I am not a religious person but I am spiritual and believe in a loving God who has onlyu the best in mind for us all.. And God doesnt make garbage you are worthy of love and capable of tapping into your core where God lives and their you will find happiness and joy like you never knew;;;

 

Ok I'll shut up

HUGGS TO FIRSTTIMER

[Boston Guy]

FT,

 

In the course of putting together a post for you, I went back to review a couple of posts. While doing so, I noted that you said something that I hadn't picked up on before:

 

As I finish up my work and life here in Chicago I don't want to change everyone's views and opinions about me.

 

It doesn't make much difference in what I'm going to recommend but are you planning on leaving Chicago in the foreseeable future?

 

BG

[firsttimer]

 

The trick to giving is that you cannot expect anything in return. Being altruistic is what makes it magic...

 

 

Totally right. It's not altruistic of me when I'm expecting something in return. I'll remember that next time I do something nice to someone as I have a bad habit of expecting something in return (which I never get back thus causing this whole problem).

 

Yes BG you read my words right. I will be leaving Chicago at the end of June for Washington DC for the next part of my job/training.

[Boston Guy]

Totally right. It's not altruistic of me when I'm expecting something in return. I'll remember that next time I do something nice to someone as I have a bad habit of expecting something in return (which I never get back thus causing this whole problem).

 

Yes BG you read my words right. I will be leaving Chicago at the end of June for Washington DC for the next part of my job/training.

 

That's what I expected to hear (including that exact date ). I'll have something for you to consider in a little while.

 

BG

[MsGuy]

May I suggest that coming out of the closet is not necessarily a binary all or nothing type thing. While in D.C. & away from anyone likely to know you from back home, you might try getting to know some gay people, maybe by doing volunteer work at local orgs. Take a pass for now on the sex thing and look for folks you are comfortable/compatible with socially. Almost all of us have had to find a way to deal with the issues that are troubling you. Seeing first hand how others are coping with family, friends, employers can't hurt. And with a gay friend you're a lot more likely to be able to discuss your feeling of isolation w/o him trying to fix you up with a girl friend of his sister. Bless her heart, my Mom was still working on getting me married off 20 years after I came out to her.

----

Try not to be too hard on yourself.

[josephga]

When I decided I was going to come out the first thing I did was tell myself first. I walked into my bathroom cut on the bathroom light looked into the mirror and said it. At that point I was 30 years old and and never had any type of sexual contact with a man. I felt it was time to try dating a guy. I was determined it wasn't going to be done slipping around. I started looking for guys to just meet on a platonic level, learn and get as much info I could get. I made the choice to meet couples that had been together for a long time to meet me for lunch or dinner so I could pick their brain, Then about a 2 months later I started up a convo with a guy on line and agreed to meet for a date, not sex but a date. That first dated ended up turning into a 2 year relationship. I told my friends right away. I knew we chose our friends and if they didn't except it then they were no friends of mine after all. The most difficult part was telling my parents and brother. My father accepted it my mother and brother Did not. I haven't seen or spoken to him in close to 7 years and don't really care either

[Boston Guy]

FT,

 

First, I don't know you at all. I'm making leaps and assumptions galore here and it's entirely possible that what I have to say is so far off the mark that you should disregard it entirely. However, short of spending a vacation with you, this is my best shot at this time. One word of caution, though: this is not short. I'll probably need to post it in several chunks. But, having strung you along with questions all day, I wanted to lay it all out in front of you.

 

First, I think that you are very lonely and that you are alone for a reason that is very easy to understand: there is no one in your life at this time, at least in any kind of even semi-affectionate way. This is, I think, the underlying problem that you are dealing with. Everything else -- the reasons why you are in this situation, the reasons why you tell yourself that you cannot change the situation, where you think you are going, what you had for breakfast this morning -- may be important but none of it is the reason for your loneliness. You are feeling lonely because you are alone. You have tried medical intervention, clinical counseling and Christian prayer and counseling, without success.

 

The fact that none of the things that you have tried have been successful is not a surprise to me, because I think that they have been trying to solve the wrong problem or, at the very least, haven't done a darned thing to solve the real problem. Antidepressants didn't help you because you're not depressed, you're sad because you're alone. Clinical therapy didn't help you (I'm guessing ) because you either wouldn't admit the real problem or didn't want to follow the advice that the therapist offered, which evidently included at least some suggestion to considering coming out. Christian counseling and prayer didn't help you because, unless you can pray a lot better than most of us, praying to have a boyfriend show up generally doesn't work as well as other methods. So you've tried a bunch of different things that were almost all doomed to failure before you even started them because they weren't trying to solve the real problem: you are alone.

 

We are all humans and we need companionship. We crave it and we need it. Without it, we are lonely, as you have discovered. This simple truth has been the subject of more books and poems and plays and shows than you can count, for hundreds and hundreds of years. It's one of the central truths of the human condition: we need companionship and affection and when we don't have it we feel lonely. Kings have gone to war over loneliness. You're not sick, you're lonely and you're lonely because you are alone.

 

Essentially, you are on a treadmill and, as you have admitted, you're finding it exhausting. Loneliness is more than just a word: it's a pain so bad you can feel it, an ache so deep that it can make life seem not worth living. You yourself have considered ending your life (perhaps not seriously but at least in passing), as have many gay men before you. Society does not make it easy to be gay, even today, but gay we are and gay we will be until the day we die. Our only real choice is whether we want to live happy lives or sad lives. I hope that you will choose to live a happy life. It is a choice and it is within your grasp. But you are so close to the problem and have been enduring it for so long that you are not objective, cannot see the problem clearly for what it is and now, I think, see it looming so very large that it seems almost unmanageable.

 

I can assure you that this problem is not only not unmanageable, it's something that you can deal with effectively, in a way that will likely lead you to joy and laughter and friendship. You only need to find the right path and there are many who will help you with that. And then, once on a good path, you will need to be patient for happiness does not come in an instant but is instead something that we accomplish.

 

As you planned your career, I bet that you had a rather orderly plan. You knew where you wanted to get to and you knew how you were going to try to get there. That's a good thing for plans give us goals to strive for and a way to know if we are still on the right path. From where I'm sitting right now, you need a bit of a plan for your life. You also need to clear your head and try to gain a bit of objectivity. And, at some point, we're going to need to talk about religion and gay people.

 

But, for the moment, you need to seriously think about some questions:

 

Where are you now?

How did you get there?

Why are you unhappy?

Where do you want to be in six months or a year or five?

What choices are you facing and what decisions can you make that will make it most likely that you get to where you want to get to?

 

This is hard stuff. Not many people really stop to think about their lives in such a critical way, not "critical" in the sense of assigning blame but rather "critical" as in a critical analysis of a set of facts to try to identify underlying meaning. It's hard to be so objective about our lives and, if you can't, perhaps someone else who knows you can help you.

 

But most of all, you have to be honest with yourself. You self-identify as a gay man but you don't want to come out, for whatever reasons. That necessarily means that you are lying to other people at some level but let's not dwell on that. What's most important is that you are honest with yourself. (If I am correct in my assumption, you may have more freedom to take some of these steps in August.)

 

Next, stop being the guy who is desperate because he's running around the maze and can't find the exit. Running around desperately leads to panic and that leads to bad decisions and all sorts of unnecessary pain and anguish. Calm down. You're not in a hurry; you won't fall apart if the love of your life doesn't come running in the door tomorrow. Give yourself a good talking to and take a few deep breaths. Patience, in this case, is almost going to be its own reward. The fact that you are alone doesn't mean that you cannot enjoy a beautiful sunset, a good meal, or a phone conversation with a good friend. The world is full of beauty all around you. It's hard to see it when we are lonely but that is one of the times when it's most important to see that beauty and to recognize that while we might be unhappy today, we won't always be unhappy. Unhappiness is a curable disease.

[Boston Guy]

You say that you don't want to come out right now. In fact, you were so concerned about the possibility of my suggesting it that you told me in advance that you couldn't come out right now. OK, let's take that for a given. I think that you should seriously examine that decision and make sure that you understand what you are deciding and why but that's for another time, too. For the moment, we'll just assume that you cannot come out. And that's ok.

 

But you are thinking of your life in black and white terms, rather than in living color. You seem to view coming out as an all or nothing decision, something that will suddenly put an "I'M GAY!!!!" rainbow sticker on your back for all to see. That's nonsense for nothing is farther from the truth. Coming out can be something that you do small step by small step. You can keep it as private as you want it to be for as long you want (but I assure that you if you start coming out, you will eventually find yourself in a place where you want to tell your friends and family). For the moment, coming out can simply be an extension of what you've already started.

 

That's right, you've already started coming out. You're posting on an Internet site, self-identifying as gay and looking for help in meeting gay men for sex. I'd say that's right up there in terms of starting to come out. And, you know what, you said a little earlier that you were feeling better and that another person said that you were sounding better today than yesterday.

 

Now why do you suppose that is? You didn't have sex with a man today. (Did you? ) But you're feeling better. Why? Hmmm... could it possibly be because you have felt the touch of friendship across the wires, the concern of other gay men for you and your feelings and your happiness? Could it be because you have discovered that others of us -- many others of us -- have at times felt the same things that you are feeling? Could it be that you have discovered that you are not as alone as you thought, or as "pathetic". (By the way, never use the word "pathetic" to describe yourself again in my presence.)

 

So, that thing that you said you would not, could not, absolutely cannot do -- come out -- turns out to be something that you're already doing. Imagine that! You've already made some gay acquaintances and today you even went for a walk with a gay man. This my friend, is your world, and welcome to it. The only thing left for you to do is to find a path that will allow you to be happy. And if that means that you need to conceal what you are doing from your friends and family for a while, so be it. Guess what: I came out in my late 20s and didn't tell any of my straight friends or family for an entire year. But I had one of the best years of my life in that first year, rediscovering myself, learning what it meant to be gay, making tons of gay friends and, yes, learning how to have sex with men.

 

And this is what I think you need to do. I think that any plan that you devise, any honest plan, has to include as part of "where I want to be in five years" the following statement: "I want to be living a happy, honest life as the gay man that I know I am." Your plan will likely include lots of other things, including career goals. But it should include as a specific goal a statement that you want to be living a happy life.

 

Which brings me full circle back to the idea of identifying what's the real problem and then taking steps to solve it. You correctly pointed out that the man who was constantly late for work wouldn't solve his problem by dressing better: he needed to solve the real problem. But you yourself have been hunting around for a feel-good solution. You're looking for a quick fix and, to a certain extent, you're allowing your desire to bed a hot A&F guy to sway your decisions. This is understandable, LOL, for you are a man. But when you let your dick lead you around, you should at least be aware of what you are doing.

[Boston Guy]

The real problem isn't that you're not having sex with hot A&F guys. It isn't even that you're not having sex with any guys. No, the problem is that you're alone. As I see it, you don't need a boyfriend, you need a friend. In fact, you need a bunch of friends because if you just found one gay friend, you're so needy right now what you'd probably overwhelm the poor guy and he'd run away screaming. LOL So you need some gay friends. And that six-word sentence is what I think is the real solution to the real problem that is haunting you.

 

You don't need antidepressants.

You don't need clinical therapy.

You don't need Christian prayer and counseling.

But you do need some gay friends.

 

And that, my friend, as far as I can see, is the problem in a nutshell. You are sad and depressed because you are lonely. You are lonely because you are alone. You are alone not because you don't know anyone -- of course you know people. You have colleagues and family and straight friends. But, in this instance, those people aren't enough. They simply cannot fill the void in your life because of one central fact: they are not gay. Gay men can certainly have good straight friends but we need gay friends in our lives. None of the people you know can help you with something that I think is a critical -- critical -- need for you and that is to become a part of a group of gay friends. In essence, you need to find a gay community that you can become part of. I don't care if you ever tell your mother or your father or your brother or your best straight friend. But you need good gay friends -- emphasis on the plural -- who you can go to dinner with or have a drink with or laugh with and drool over beautiful men with. You need to populate your life with some people who are like you. And once you begin to do that, you'll start to have occasions to go out with your friends and meet others. And, sooner or later, one of those guys will be someone you like and who likes you and you'll find to your amazement that you suddenly seem to have a boyfriend. And that will be the day that you know for sure that you are no longer lonely. And when that day occurs, I want to you to remember back to yesterday, when you were so sad and depressed, and to realize how far you have come down the road toward happiness. It's something that you can have but you need to make some good decisions.

 

And as for escorts, well, you'll notice that they're not in the plan that I've prescribed for you. I think that going out and meeting an escort would be a very bad idea for you right now. Why? Because it's not solving the real problem and, worse, it's letting you think that using a false solution can somehow solve the real problem. Worse yet, if you meet a nice escort in your current state of mind, you're going to fall head over heels in love in about thirty seconds. Unfortunately, you'll have also fallen head over heels in love with someone who is emotionally unavailable to you so you'll be in even a worse spot that you are right now. No, while I enjoy hiring escorts myself from time to time, I think that hiring escorts is a very unwise choice for you at this time.

 

If you're still with me, and I hope you are, then you need to think about those questions and build a plan for your life. But most of all, you need to make some gay friends, even if you don't tell anyone at all in your life what it is that is suddenly bringing a smile to your face. And why do I say that particular thing?

 

When I was 28, I was working at a place where I had a good friend. She and I are still friends. I'd started coming out six months before but hadn't told anyone in my "normal life" what I was doing. One day, I was walking down a corridor and she was walking the other way. She stopped me and she said these words: "I don't know what you're doing that is making you so happy. I'm not sure that I should know what you're doing. But whatever it is that you are doing that is bringing a smile to your face these days, please keep doing it." And she smiled at me and gave me a little hug and walked away. And that is a day that I'll never forget for it was the moment that I knew for sure that I was on the right path for me.

[firsttimer]

Wow I don't even know where to begin. Such an overwhelming outpouring of advice! Which in summary is great advice.

Let's see if I can tackle some of what you brought up before I go to sleep.

 

I'm making leaps and assumptions galore here and it's entirely possible that what I have to say is so far off the mark that you should disregard it entirely.

 

You are making assumptions but they are mostly all correct. If they are a little off then I try to explain more to see how that changes your advice.

 

You are feeling lonely because you are alone.

... I think that they have been trying to solve the wrong problem or, at the very least, haven't done a darned thing to solve the real problem...

...solve the real problem: you are alone.

...you're lonely and you're lonely because you are alone.

 

So many 'alone's in that paragraph. Yes I am ALONE. Well not totally alone since I have you talking to me all day. Several other board members who are also trying to talk me through this with email and even one board member who drove up and met me today for a chat in person (and another member has met up with me last month who just isn't in town anymore). So yes, I am feeling better today than yesterday as you mentioned in another part of your posting.

 

But, for the moment, you need to seriously think about some questions:

 

Where are you now?

 

I am alone in Chicago. I thought that was clear already?

I have family and friends, but not any gay friends.

I have an apartment, a job, and work crazy hours.

I'm tired of running on the treadmill.

I am at a point in life where I'm willing to try and break free and explore a little more about my sexuality where I wasn't ready for this a year or even months ago. Thus I am here on this board talking to strangers about my innermost thoughts.

Did I mention I was alone?

 

How did you get there?

I came out of my mother's womb on a cold January day 28 years ago.

I flew here from my hometown on the East Coast for college and never left.

I stepped on that treadmill in first grade and am still running on it.

Years of sexual repression... that lead me to be alone.

 

Why are you unhappy?

It must be obvious by now. I'm ALONE!

No really, really I'm unhappy because I got myself to this place and feel like I don't know how to get out of this hole or off of this treadmill. But I want some helpful advice so I came on the board and started this thread.

 

Where do you want to be in six months or a year or five?

I want to be at a place in life where I'm happier than I am now because I made some changes in my life and explored new ground.

 

What choices are you facing and what decisions can you make that will make it most likely that you get to where you want to get to?

 

I cannot chose where I work until three more years later so that's a given.

I need to decide if I want to come out eventually or stay in the closet.

Should I upset my family, who already knows by the way, and actually tell other people about my gay feelings?

Should I hire escorts to try to fill some of this void?

Do I want to get married and have kids (be it a guy or a girl)?

But the most immediate question is, what can I do to stop being alone.

 

But most of all, you have to be honest with yourself. You self-identify as a gay man but you don't want to come out, for whatever reasons. That necessarily means that you are lying to other people at some level but let's not dwell on that. What's most important is that you are honest with yourself.

I am definitely more honest with myself about this since I started this journey back in August. I am coming to terms better with these feeling and now at least willing to try to have some experiences. So I think that is some progress right?

 

Okay on to part 2...

[Boston Guy]

So I think that is some progress right?

 

More progress than I think you know. At the end of the day, I think that you are already on the right road. You just don't know it yet and you haven't yet seen around some of the twists and turns that the road takes. But you have set foot on the right road and you're walking in the right direction.

 

[firsttimer]

For the moment, we'll just assume that you cannot come out. And that's ok.

Thank you for not forcing me to come out to everyone in the world! I can't say it enough that I am NOT READY for that step.

 

But as you said I am ready to come out to strangers who I may never see in my life face to face. As it's easier to do that in a semi-anonymous way like on this board. Or to other board members through private email like I have been with jackcali, ted, and greatness over the past few months. Or meeting up with someone I spoke to for the first time yesterday TBinChi and just laying it out there on the table. So in a way I am slowly coming out to some people.

 

Also an easier part that is usually the hard part for most other people coming out is that my whole immediate family knows. Now none of them agree with me on this issue and would like me NOT to be gay, but at least I'm not hiding this from them (although I do hide some parts, like mom and dad wouldn't want to know that I've tried hiring an escort, that would not go so well). And they are willing to listen if I want to talk to them about it even if they want me to change.

 

Now why do you suppose that is?

...you're feeling better. Why? Hmmm... could it possibly be because you have felt the touch of friendship across the wires, the concern of other gay men for you and your feelings and your happiness? Could it be because you have discovered that others of us -- many others of us -- have at times felt the same things that you are feeling?

I felt better because I could be honest about my feelings with someone who could also relate to what I'm going through

 

You didn't have sex with a man today. (Did you? )

No, I did not have sex with TBinChi, but we did talk a lot about sex

 

So, that thing that you said you would not, could not, absolutely cannot do -- come out -- turns out to be something that you're already doing. Imagine that!

Yes, I've realized I came out to you all back in August when I first posted.

 

And this is what I think you need to do. I think that any plan that you devise, any honest plan, has to include as part of "where I want to be in five years" the following statement: "I want to be living a happy, honest life as the gay man that I know I am."

That is hard to swallow as you can tell since I'm still struggling with coming out to everyone. But yes that is a likely possibility of what I may chose for my future.

 

But when you let your dick lead you around, you should at least be aware of what you are doing.

When I let my dick lead me around, I make bad choices. So I am here to bounce ideas off of you before I go make more bad choices. I am 28 and have raging hormones so I am trying to reign them in and think with a clearer mind with your guidance.

[Boston Guy]

So many 'alone's in that paragraph. Yes I am ALONE. Well not totally alone since I have you talking to me all day. Several other board members who are also trying to talk me through this with email and even one board member who drove up and met me today for a chat in person (and another member has met up with me last month who just isn't in town anymore). So yes, I am feeling better today than yesterday as you mentioned in another part of your posting.

 

Remember that I used the word 'insidious' way back at the beginning of the day? Well loneliness is insidious. It makes us think that we are completely alone. But none of us is ever completely alone. And as you are now realizing, you are not alone, either.

 

It's true that you are alone in Chicago and it is true that you need to make some good gay friends. But you are not truly alone, for we are here at the ends of these wires.