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The new Manhattan DA has decriminalized most crimes now.


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Manhattan DA Alvin Bragg to stop seeking prison in some cases (nypost.com)

 

OMG.  Just when you thought things couldn't get any dumber.  Watch the crime rate in NYC soar.

 

"Armed robbers who use guns or other deadly weapons to stick up stores and other businesses will be prosecuted only for petty larceny, a misdemeanor, provided no victims were seriously injured and there’s no “genuine risk of physical harm” to anyone" is but one of the changes. The criminals are going to have a field day in NYC.  

Edited by augustus
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I had high hopes that Mayor Adams would not only bring sanity to the Mayor’s office but also show Democrats a winning alternative to far leftist ideas to make people’s lives better.  This DA’s plans are a kick in Mayor Adams’ nuts.😱

How long before the rising crime rate soars and people flee the city?  How low will the quality of life fall?

Unless they bring back The Gaiety, I do not want to see the “old” NYC return.

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DA Alvin Bragg is another Soros-elected district attorney.  Soros donated $1 million to the Color of Change PAC, which in turn spent heavily to get Bragg elected.  Soros DAs include Kim Fox (who was going to let Jussie Smollett skate without charges until others intervened), Kim Gardner (St. Louis Circuit Attorney who failed to show up for multiple hearings for a defendant charged with murder, causing the judge to let the defendant go free), and George Gascon.

Soros wants to "reimagine" our criminal justice system, and he spends big bucks to elect DAs who share his vision.  In every city with a Soros DA, crime is through the roof.

I feel bad for Mayor Eric Adams.  It must be so frustrating for cops to apprehend the bad guy, only for the DA to let him skate.  The 22-year police veteran wants to restore law and order to NYC whereas his DA wants to let most criminals off scot free.  In other words, the new mayor is facing a helluva headwind.

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On 1/4/2022 at 9:29 PM, BSR said:

DA Alvin Bragg is another Soros-elected district attorney.  Soros donated $1 million to the Color of Change PAC, which in turn spent heavily to get Bragg elected.  Soros DAs include Kim Fox (who was going to let Jussie Smollett skate without charges until others intervened), Kim Gardner (St. Louis Circuit Attorney who failed to show up for multiple hearings for a defendant charged with murder, causing the judge to let the defendant go free), and George Gascon.

Soros wants to "reimagine" our criminal justice system, and he spends big bucks to elect DAs who share his vision.  In every city with a Soros DA, crime is through the roof.

I feel bad for Mayor Eric Adams.  It must be so frustrating for cops to apprehend the bad guy, only for the DA to let him skate.  The 22-year police veteran wants to restore law and order to NYC whereas his DA wants to let most criminals off scot free.  In other words, the new mayor is facing a helluva headwind.

Philadelphia's DA Krasner is very popular, thank goodness.

No wonder after Mayors Frank Rizzo and Wilson Goode. But, the  relatively recent problem was long time DA Lynn Abraham. Ms. Law and Order and her corrupt successors.

Edited by WilliamM
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5 hours ago, TumYum said:

… the complexities of NYC criminal justice reform…

The headline may be an exaggeration, but it’s not a lie.  

But I do think we found the problem - the fact that someone thinks that criminal justice needs to be “complex” probably defines why crime is even a problem.  It’s easy.  You break the law, you get caught, you get a fair trial, and - if found guilty - you go to jail.   Complexities tend to be efforts to justify and rationalize bad behaviors. 

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53 minutes ago, BnaC said:

The headline may be an exaggeration, but it’s not a lie.  

But I do think we found the problem - the fact that someone thinks that criminal justice needs to be “complex” probably defines why crime is even a problem.  It’s easy.  You break the law, you get caught, you get a fair trial, and - if found guilty - you go to jail.   Complexities tend to be efforts to justify and rationalize bad behaviors. 

It most certainly is a lie. The DA has no authority to decriminalize anything. That's up to the legislature.

Your simplistic second paragraph fails to account for the fact that minorities suffer the most under law enforcement. White people are treated better and fare better. That's a fact!

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3 minutes ago, Lucky said:

It most certainly is a lie. The DA has no authority to decriminalize anything. That's up to the legislature.

Your simplistic second paragraph fails to account for the fact that minorities suffer the most under law enforcement. White people are treated better and fare better. That's a fact!

The criminal laws are meaningless IF the DA does not enforce them.  His actions are in effect “decriminalizing”.  

Minorities suffer most from criminal behavior.  That’s a fact!  Intra-racial crime is far larger than trans-racial crime.  That’s a fact!

Minorities do suffer from bad law enforcement and there needs to be police reform to reduce bad interactions.  That’s a fact!  Minorities do suffer from flaws in the criminal justice system.  That’s a fact!  

 What we need to do is repair both our law enforcement and criminal justice systems.  However, this new group of DA’s elected with the help of George Soros seem to be failing when it comes to pragmatic results.  While the pandemic is affecting all types of comparisons to past years, so far the results from “decriminalizing”/not prosecuting certain crimes, bail “reform”, emptying the jails, etc seems not to be working.

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29 minutes ago, Lucky said:

It most certainly is a lie. The DA has no authority to decriminalize anything. That's up to the legislature.

Your simplistic second paragraph fails to account for the fact that minorities suffer the most under law enforcement. White people are treated better and fare better. That's a fact!

Then tell the DA to do his job as directed in the laws established by the legislature. 

interesting that you’ve bifurcated the issue of guilt or innocence based on the artificial construct that race determines whether or not someone’s committed a crime.  And, I know what your response will be…but it’s a red herring to distract from realities by trying to make a simple thing complex.  

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31 minutes ago, Lucky said:

It most certainly is a lie. The DA has no authority to decriminalize anything. That's up to the legislature.

Your simplistic second paragraph fails to account for the fact that minorities suffer the most under law enforcement. White people are treated better and fare better. That's a fact!

More precisely, the children of single mothers & absent fathers "suffer" disproportionately under law enforcement.  If you remove all other variables (poverty, education level, etc.) and focus exclusively on children of single mothers vs. those raised in 2-parent homes, the crime rates for all races are about the same.

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There's more than a hint of hyperbole in the title of the thread. 'Most crimes' hugely overstates what seems to be being done, and as has already been stated a DA (or prosecutor in any jurisdiction) can't decriminalise anything, they can only decide how or if a case is prosecuted. The police can also do something similar by issuing a caution or warning rather than ticketing the alleged offender or arresting them. If they caution people in rich neighbourhoods and arrest them in poor ones, irrespective of the race of the person concerned, that is a problem.

Some of the things being proposed seem hugely problematic to me, and I would say go too far, but the idea shouldn't be frightening. Every offence is not a crime, and the border line between what needs to be taken to court and what should be treated as a misdemeanour needs to be looked at more closely. What isn't needed is a hysterical 'throw the lot of them in gaol' campaign.

Drug possession for personal use and jay walking should not end up with someone in court. Bankers are rarely prosecuted for cocaine use or possession, why should people who through their circumstance have no alternative to doing their drug taking in a public place be prosecuted for that. Is their real crime the offending of middle class sensibilities or being unsightly? There are better diversion methods that don't end up with people falling into the criminal justice and prison systems. Jay walking wasn't an offence until cars came along and car companies wanted the people stopped from using their streets if that use inconvenienced motorists.

Reforming the criminal justice system is difficult, especially in a political system where a government can't decide on a policy and insist that its legislators pass it, and even if they can they are still subject to ''lawn order' radio shock jocks and tabloid newspapers ranting. The police and prosecutors with discretion on how they handle alleged offenders can test different approaches towards discouraging or preventing some offending. Prosecutorial guidelines and a community policing model rather than an arrest now and ask questions later model can help, but I don't pretend keeping people out of gaol who don't need to be there is easy when the system isn't smart enough to find an alternative that reduces offending in the long term. If you want lifetime criminals throw young offenders in gaol and you'll get them.

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Legislature has discretion in crafting laws, even the ones written for them by outside interests.

Executive appoints (or citizens vote for) the head prosecutor, who has discretion in prioritizing the Dept resources in handling multiple cases involving various violations of existing laws.

Judicial branch has discretion in interpretation of the law, decisions some of which address a particular case, but later are cited in rulings elsewhere. 

All branches have discretion with the ability to weigh in on whether particular behavior is criminal, some before it happens, some after it happens, but when democracy functions, the people are represented. DA’s and AG’s must make executive decisions about degree/scale of public harm, likelihood of conviction, factoring mitigation or aggravation, punitive requests, degree of public risk, assessing continuation of ongoing threat, etc, and there are some cases the public will wish had more focus, and some who wish for it to have had less.

Personally I think large-scale  ongoing threats that remain under-prosecuted are financial, tax, and corruption crimes, and I think more people would be better-served by State and Federal prosecutors allocating prosecutorial and correctional dollars to punish white-collar criminals especially CEO’s.

But I do not live in NY… 

 

 

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11 hours ago, WilliamM said:

Philadelphia's DA Krasner is very popular, thank goodness.

No wonder after Mayors Frank Rizzo and Wilson Goode. But, the  relatively recent problem was long time DA Lynn Abraham. Ms. Law and Order and her corrupt successors.

Yeah, Krasner is a smash hit.  Murders in Philly have doubled under his watch.  And you live there.

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Lucky said:

It most certainly is a lie. The DA has no authority to decriminalize anything. That's up to the legislature.

Your simplistic second paragraph fails to account for the fact that minorities suffer the most under law enforcement. White people are treated better and fare better. That's a fact!

OMG!   Blacks are being murdered at record rates in Philly, Chicago and Baltimore because of you liberal progressives.  So I guess that's alright with you, as long as some notion of "racist injustice" is addressed, in your mind.  

Edited by augustus
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2 hours ago, mike carey said:

There's more than a hint of hyperbole in the title of the thread. 'Most crimes' hugely overstates what seems to be being done, and as has already been stated a DA (or prosecutor in any jurisdiction) can't decriminalise anything, they can only decide how or if a case is prosecuted

This new NYC DA is a nutjob who has given the order to not prosecute most crimes to the full extent of the law.  What moron would turn armed robbery into a petty offense??!!  

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2 hours ago, mike carey said:

Drug possession for personal use and jay walking should not end up with someone in court. Bankers are rarely prosecuted for cocaine use or possession, why should people who through their circumstance have no alternative to doing their drug taking in a public place be prosecuted for that. Is their real crime the offending of middle class sensibilities or being unsightly?

These are the type of statements that come from armchair liberals!   Drug possession has been treated as a ticketed offense in NYC for many years, doesn't matter if your rich, middle class or poor.  

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49 minutes ago, jeezifonly said:

Personally I think large-scale  ongoing threats that remain under-prosecuted are financial, tax, and corruption crimes, and I think more people would be better-served by State and Federal prosecutors allocating prosecutorial and correctional dollars to punish white-collar criminals especially CEO’s.

White collar crimes are often without direct victims except for someone depriving society of something it might have otherwise received.  

but, while someone might also claim that, say, drug abuse is also without victim (except the abuser themselves), similarly, the abuser is depriving society of something it might otherwise receive - the productive contribution of the abuser or the cost of assisting the abuser through inevitable health crises, etc.  

in this way, drug abuser fall in the same bucket as financial, tax, and corruption criminals.  

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3 minutes ago, augustus said:

OMG!   Blacks are being murdered at record rates in Philly, Chicago and Baltimore because of you liberal progressives.  So I guess that's alright with you, as long as some notion of "racist injustice" is satisfactory to you.  

There are multiple reasons for the increase. So frustrating to read the same thing over and over  Like this:  it is the DA' s

Pandemic, lack of jobs, guns as readily available, gangs, race and a dozen more

 

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3 minutes ago, augustus said:

These are the type of statements that come from armchair liberals!   Drug possession has been treated as a ticketed offense in NYC for many years, doesn't matter if your rich, middle class or poor.  

There are few and far between arm chair liberals in large cities. That phrase was old fashioned in the 1960s.

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1 hour ago, jeezifonly said:

Legislature has discretion in crafting laws, even the ones written for them by outside interests.

Executive appoints (or citizens vote for) the head prosecutor, who has discretion in prioritizing the Dept resources in handling multiple cases involving various violations of existing laws.

Judicial branch has discretion in interpretation of the law, decisions some of which address a particular case, but later are cited in rulings elsewhere. 

All branches have discretion with the ability to weigh in on whether particular behavior is criminal, some before it happens, some after it happens, but when democracy functions, the people are represented. DA’s and AG’s must make executive decisions about degree/scale of public harm, likelihood of conviction, factoring mitigation or aggravation, punitive requests, degree of public risk, assessing continuation of ongoing threat, etc, and there are some cases the public will wish had more focus, and some who wish for it to have had less.

Personally I think large-scale  ongoing threats that remain under-prosecuted are financial, tax, and corruption crimes, and I think more people would be better-served by State and Federal prosecutors allocating prosecutorial and correctional dollars to punish white-collar criminals especially CEO’s.

But I do not live in NY… 

 

 

The problem with discretion is that it’s rarely about resource allocation and often isn’t applied fairly and consistently.  Case in point - Ahmaud Abery’s killers were sentenced to life today.  An appropriate sentence for a heinous crime.   But, if I recall correctly, using discretion, the sheriff’s department slow walked the investigation leading to their arrest.  While I agree that discretion is important in the system, it’s a double edged sword. 

Edited by BnaC
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26 minutes ago, WilliamM said:

There are multiple reasons for the increase. So frustrating to read the same thing over and over  Like this:  it is the DA' s

Pandemic, lack of jobs, guns as readily available, gangs, race and a dozen more

Funny, there aren't a lack of jobs.  Guns have been readily available for years.  And we have the fattest poor people in the world.  Lunatic DA's like yours in Philly are the problem.  They are soft and the criminals pick up on that in an instant.  

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Why anyone supports the criminal element is beyond me.  I can't believe there are such fools in this world. The new NYC DA comes from a family of criminals and so does the San Francisco DA.  No surprise they would let their friends run amok.  And most of the people supporting this trash are the dumb ass white progressives.  Let them get bashed in the head. You can't fix stupid. 

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